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Thread: Winding AC motor

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Winding AC motor

    After foolishly powering a 14VAC motor with 120VAC...I needed to replace or repair.

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    The windings burned off the enamel and shorted. The windings are wrapped on a plastic spool slipped over a steel core.
    The steel core was driven out of its press fit into the "C" shaped frame. Hence its name C frame shaded pole induction motor.
    Unfortunately the plastic spool crumbled during disassembling.

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    I measured the diameter, and determined the wire to be 24AWG enameled wire. Counted the number of winds, and measured the length.I think it was 280 winds at 80 feet long. Bought 100' of wire for $8, and can of insulating spray for about $15.
    Built a jig from scrap wood, and made a spool from a Sugar Babies candy box.

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    The spray is an electrical insulator, that also seals and binds the windings. I sprayed between layers for maximum protection.
    I tried to make perfect even windings. I failed miserably! Gave it several coats and allowed to dry. The cardboard spool started to come apart.

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    Solder on some primary wire leads and a few wraps of electrical tape.
    Reassemble and test.

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    Pachi Puro Moparformances's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    oh oh oh wait a minute, let me get some
    Never Doubt that a small group of thoughtful, .......... /........ If your not going to stand behind our troops
    ...committed people can change the world. ............. /.................Please, Please stand in front of them
    .....Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has............./
    .........................................Margaret Mead

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    I was thrown out of Top Gear Drunkenclam's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    A still image of a turning motor
    Ian #UKPachinko

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Drunkenclam View Post
    A still image of a turning motor
    I was laughing about that as I was taking the picture!
    The motor winds that I did were not straight. Gaps, crossings forth and back, 2 or more turns in the same spot to fill a valley, etc.
    I was concerned if it would even turn. I skipped adding a mechanical counter (didn't want to take apart "Brains Beer" to get one)...my brother suggested a simple electronic counter..."I can count to 300!" Needless to say, I lost count several times. I'll bet my windings are closer to 320 to 330. I would expect that more windings = more speed. Since it runs...I will continue the conversion first. When that is successful, then I might rewind and experiment with # of winds.
    The motor runs smooth and quiet! Almost silent! When put on the...transmission? The assembly with the crank arm that trips the flipper...is very LOUD. Just a gritty, rattling kind of sound. I cant remember if it was this loud before. There is also a lot of play in the final drive. I have a couple pics in my phone.

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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    this thread is very anticlimactic

    went from Hollywood to low budget Bollywood

    ill stick it out to the credits, it has a good start
    Never Doubt that a small group of thoughtful, .......... /........ If your not going to stand behind our troops
    ...committed people can change the world. ............. /.................Please, Please stand in front of them
    .....Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has............./
    .........................................Margaret Mead

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    Little gear, big gear, little gear between motor and final drive. This much play between 3 gears? I want to take it apart to see, but the brass pin is peened. I know I can do it...but not yet. I already burned out the motor, got lucky and fixed it. I want to make the conversion first...then risk damage by rebuilding it LATER.

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Moparformances View Post
    this thread is very anticlimactic went from Hollywood to low budget Bollywood ill stick it out to the credits, it has a good start
    Not sure what you expected...the rebuild was based on "low budget Bollywood" to begin with! The whole motor rewind cost less than $30 the shooter was about the same cost when bought. I feel great about that part. Even a $12 replacement motor was more than that with shipping.I started a new thread because this is more of "My poor burned out motor" than My poor unloved Comet 2. I felt the motor winding was just too much for the conversion thread.

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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    Quote Originally Posted by pachiwall View Post
    Not sure what you expected...
    i did not mean to insult or anything of the like..

    you posted 4 great post in 30 mins then kinda went dark..

    things are looking good now..

    I'm very interested in how your fixing this.. i would have never thought about trying to rewind the motor..

    I'm impressed
    Never Doubt that a small group of thoughtful, .......... /........ If your not going to stand behind our troops
    ...committed people can change the world. ............. /.................Please, Please stand in front of them
    .....Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has............./
    .........................................Margaret Mead

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    Quote Originally Posted by Moparformances View Post

    you posted 4 great post in 30 mins then kinda went dark..
    I can't get my camera and computer to like each other...so I added Tapatalk to my phone. I can now post pics...but I don't like typing on a virtual keyboard. Plus I don't know how to get the pics to match my text. So, a giant paragraph at the top...with a row of pics at the bottom.To get a good looking/ easy to understand post...I will post a series of pics on Tapatalk. Then edit and add text from a real keyboard with my desktop. However you only have 10 min to edit, or you lose all the text.Oh yeah...can't add emojis.
    I started this as a new thread, because if it becomes a Q&A about motors, it gets farther away from the Comet II thread.
    I'm thinking about buying a much larger spool of wire and making a better quality winding, now that I know that even a sloppily wound one works! All that kind of stuff goes here. All shooter conversion stuff goes to "poor unloved"
    Last edited by pachiwall; 11-29-2020 at 01:48 AM.

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    Master Inventor daverob's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    How neat the windings are makes very little difference to the motor. If the windings have the same number of turns, one neat and one sloppily wound, the only difference is that the sloppily wound one will have used a slightly longer length of wire (so the DC resistance of the wire will be a little higher but probably only by a percent or two), and the outermost windings will be a little further away from the centre of the coil (which makes a tiny difference to the magnetic field strength.

    Both will make the motor a little weaker, but the effect is almost negligible, The effect of the extra DC resistance will be very small compared to the AC inductance of the winding, so the overall effect will be less than 1%, the winding geometry losses will be equivalent to losing a couple of turns of wire.

    So all in all, if you want to re-wind the motor again to make it neater, then that is really all that you're doing - 'making it neater', it won't have any noticeable effect on the performance of the motor.

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    Thanks! I knew it worked, I didn't know the effect it may have had. It was easy to seea neat row on the 1st layer...when it was red wire on white cardboard. However, once wrapping red on top of red while sealing the layers with red enamel...I couldn't tell where I was or where I had been.

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    Speaking of the spray between winds...

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    It is CRC #18410. Seal Coat Red urethane coating. Electrical and electronic coating.
    Its purpose is to mechanically bind the windings so they don't move with motor vibrations, possibly causing insulation from wearing through causing a short. It also prevents dust and oils out of the windings. I never would have thought about it, I learned about it when I was researching winding motors. The original stuff is heated and dipped. It was about $90 a gallon This is more for the hobbyist. it was about $15

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    Pachi Puro naha13's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    If you rewind another one, maybe you could find a way to mount it on a slow moving drill motor so you can keep some tension on the wire as you wind it. Just a thought. Good work!
    Pachinko -Nishijin "C" Fishing Game & Hockey, Red Lions, CR Red Lions, Heiwa Double Wing, Takao Bruce Lee, SanseiR&D 777 Sevens Rock, Sankyo Wanted!, lots of other vintages!; Pachislo -SPIN LUCK, Kung Fu Lady, Gamera High Grade, Gundam

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    Pachi Puro pachiwall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Winding AC motor

    I've seen videos and pics of rigs hobbyists have made with drills or motors. These are on forums similar to ours...with different hobbies. That is where I got the idea of using the mechanical counter from a slot machine I have.
    My brother convinced me to build a simple electronic counter. I will likely rewind a nicer coil, with a more robust spool...later.
    Right now I am trying to mount the whole assembly. When I finally get it all to work, then I will look into a nicer coil.
    Thank you for your input!

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