Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2
Results 21 to 30 of 30

Thread: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions and General Q/A Thread

  1. #21
    Eye Shooter p.opus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Coral Springs, Florida
    Posts
    734
    Thanks
    48
    Thanks Received
    725

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    I don't know if every machine has different versions. But in my experience, those machines that do, often have different cells. For example there were 3 different Star Wars Cell Images. On my Yamato, the "heavy" version features Kodai/Yuki couple where mine "lite" features Dessla.

    Also the different models often have information tabs on the cell itself that explains what model it is as well as the odds for that machine.

    The "light" and "heavy" machines are usually setup to basically payout the same "statistically" .

    For example, my Yamato machine has 1/99 odds for a bonus, vs the 1/310 odds for a bonus for the "heavy". However, the majority of my bonus consists of 10 ball payouts for 7 rounds at 8 payouts per round (560). The "heavy" machine has a payout of 13 ball payouts for 15 rounds at 9 balls per round (1755).

    So while my odds are roughly 3 times greater, my payout is roughly 1/3. In the long run the machines should pay out roughly the same. It just means that the "lite" versions don't have the "big" wins that their "heavy" ones have.
    71 Nishijin "A" Bowling, 80's Nishijin Hit Parade , 05 Sankyo Star Wars, 07 Fuji Yamato 1, 09 Fuji Yamato 2
    ----------> ----------> ....And so it goes...

  2. #22
    Sandwich Shooter Sederien's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    440
    Thanks
    94
    Thanks Received
    1,349

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    Quote Originally Posted by KimbaWLion View Post
    I have a Minisuka Police 2 and it the light version, the KS. I am going to assume to get a 15R it will take some luck too!
    I guess I will have to play it a lot more! Let me know what you think as usual! Its always appreciated!

    瓊猀薔艄迉馴咱搘磪馳產芄荂呁耀薜氿氿瓊氶芊坏悒薔韞野茈馴 (由民申旦)
    Sorry... I think I'm missing the question. Are you asking what the chance is that you'll get a 15R on that particular machine or are you asking me to share my thoughts about the machine you already own?

    Quote Originally Posted by PachiPachi View Post
    For every pachinko machine is there a lite and heavy version that looks identicle to one another? Same frame and cell, just different ratios?
    There are many, many pachinko machines that come in either a light or a heavy, but not both. Though the new trend has been for modern machine makers to offer both a light and a heavy version, it's by no means a guarantee.

    When you do have both a light and heavy version of the same machine produced, it is usually identified by the change in the cell background (different color, a banner saying it's the light version, etc.) as well as on the mandated cell odds sticker. The frame and cell layout (not background image) is always the same, however. Occasionally even the background is the same and the only difference is in the factory set odds.

    And before anyone asks, "No, the odds are not changeable." It is one or the other when it leaves the factory and that is it.
    Currently Own: Nothing. I play mostly online now.

  3. The following 2 users say "Thanks" to Sederien


  4. #23
    Fever Hunter PachiPachi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    173
    Thanks
    82
    Thanks Received
    174

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    Thank you! I did a little bit of research and I noticed the light version had kanji on the cell (probably meant lite version), as well as the color seemed to be lighter on the Eva 7. Your response really helped. That is great to know!
    I am looking for a Hokuto No Ken (Fist of the North Star) Pachinko/Pachislo. If you have one for sale and are in the USA please let me know!
    Pachislo - Hokuto No Ken 2003 _ Pachinko - Evangelion
    7 2012 - Super Sea Story 2006

  5. #24
    Eye Shooter p.opus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Coral Springs, Florida
    Posts
    734
    Thanks
    48
    Thanks Received
    725

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    Sederien:

    Can you shed some light on why the "lite" version (higher odds) machines were developed. I've been playing mine for some time, and I definitely hit fever rounds much more often, but the payouts are so low, that it is almost impossible to get "ahead". On a 500 ball investment, you need to trade out 800 balls just to break even. On a light machine, this requires at least a Kakuhen followed by a Jitan and even then you "barely" get over. If you double the investment, you are looking at 3 to 4 fever rounds, not easy.

    Last night I had 4 fevers (3 Kakuhen followed by a Jitan) and only came out approximately 7300 yen ahead (assuming a 2.5/yen buyback. Continuing after those 4 rounds would have almost certainly wiped me out. On the Heavy machines, If I get two Kakuhen in a row, I stand a real good chance of winning back enough balls to outlast the "dry spell" between a Jitan bonus and the next bonus. On the light machines this is not even close to the case.

    Were these machines designed for some of the 1yen/ball rental parlors where a huge fever would wipe out the house? Was it a marketing ploy to be able to advertise a real low "odds" machine to generate greater interest in the machine only to take you out due to it's reduced payout?

    Thanks for your answer in advance. I love learning some of the weird details of this bizarre obsession we all share.
    71 Nishijin "A" Bowling, 80's Nishijin Hit Parade , 05 Sankyo Star Wars, 07 Fuji Yamato 1, 09 Fuji Yamato 2
    ----------> ----------> ....And so it goes...

  6. #25
    Sandwich Shooter Sederien's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    440
    Thanks
    94
    Thanks Received
    1,349

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    I don't have any specific insight into the history of the development of the light machines, but I would venture to guess that it had to do with attracting more customer types to the game. (Some people like high risk/high reward present in the heavies while others may prefer winning more often using light machines.) Due note, however, that pachinko palours in Japan do not typically pay back 2.5 out of 4 in most places anymore. It's more like 3 and really, that's only outside of Tokyo. Many places in Tokyo have switched to 1:1.

    The payout rate of a particular place doesn't really matter though. What matters is the number of spins you can get per X balls. That's called the borderline. And as long as you get more spins per balls in (on average), you have a chance to "win."*

    *
    Spoiler


    To put it in perspective Your FPW machine (the 1/99.3 one) has the following borderlines:

    2.5円 20
    3.0円 19
    3.5円 18
    4.0円 16.8

    That means at 2.5 yen back per ball, you want at least 20 spins for every 1000 yen (250 balls). That's roughly one spin every 12.5 balls, by the way. If, however, you get a 1:1 payout, you want at least 16.8 spins per 250 balls. That's a much more reasonable seeming spin every 14.9 balls... BUT it doesn't matter because the palour is assuredly tweaking the pins so that you are just under to WAY under that amount of spins on average.

    In short, Light/Heavy doesn't matter. They're equally as likely to take your money. The number of spins you need per machine at the palour rates does.
    Currently Own: Nothing. I play mostly online now.

  7. The following 4 users say "Thanks" to Sederien


  8. #26
    Eye Shooter p.opus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Coral Springs, Florida
    Posts
    734
    Thanks
    48
    Thanks Received
    725

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    That is very enlightening. I know the 2.5 buyback/4.0 rental stat was several years old. I thought it still applied but obviously it does not. Statistically on the odds, the manufacturers seem to make their heavies and lights have the same odds. A 1/99 machine pays 1/3 the amount of a 1/300 machine.

    So even as Pachinko has developed it still all lies with the master nail bender and he, more than anything else makes or breaks the house after all these years. Amazing.
    71 Nishijin "A" Bowling, 80's Nishijin Hit Parade , 05 Sankyo Star Wars, 07 Fuji Yamato 1, 09 Fuji Yamato 2
    ----------> ----------> ....And so it goes...

  9. The following user says "Thanks" to p.opus


  10. #27
    Eye Shooter p.opus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Coral Springs, Florida
    Posts
    734
    Thanks
    48
    Thanks Received
    725

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    Well, Sederien:

    You are right once again. You said my Yamato 2 had a 2CR bonus round and I kind of doubted you since it was not mentioned on Fuji's official page. However, you proved me wrong. Thank you for telling me what to look for, If we had not had that discussion, I would not have recognized it for what it was.

    I was playing normally, and during a reach, the machine interrupted the reach and went to a extended "warp" animation sequence that I had never seen before. And then after the animation was over, I was in Kakuhen mode. Just like that.

    Normally I would have gone WTF? But after our discussion, I realized I had just hit a 2 Round Bonus. On my machine they are pretty rare. In fact, I've had the exact same number of 2 round bonus as 15 round bonus. Still cool though. Adds a wrinkle.
    71 Nishijin "A" Bowling, 80's Nishijin Hit Parade , 05 Sankyo Star Wars, 07 Fuji Yamato 1, 09 Fuji Yamato 2
    ----------> ----------> ....And so it goes...

  11. The following user says "Thanks" to p.opus


  12. #28
    Pachi Puro KimbaWLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    JUST outside Philadephia Pennsylvania
    Posts
    2,651
    Thanks
    5,022
    Thanks Received
    2,457

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    Sederien is always right in my humble experiences...
    Oh even though I own the machine I asked about I have hit many fevers and they were short ones my question while poorly
    worded was stated as I guess it will hit a 15R eventually. I have not played it as much as I would like because I have been
    rehabbing my basement since a MAJOR flood... Sorry for the confusion...
    I may not be the best guy, BUT I am not the bad guy!- Coop from Megas XLR

  13. #29
    Sandwich Shooter Sederien's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    440
    Thanks
    94
    Thanks Received
    1,349

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    Quote Originally Posted by KimbaWLion View Post
    Oh even though I own the machine I asked about I have hit many fevers and they were short ones my question while poorly
    worded was stated as I guess it will hit a 15R eventually. I have not played it as much as I would like because I have been
    rehabbing my basement since a MAJOR flood... Sorry for the confusion...
    Ah, well you've got a 4% chance of a 15R on any win on that machine.

    Also, a 38% chance of a 4R kakuhen and a 48% chance of a 4R regular. The remaining 10% is a 2R win as explained in previous posts. ^^
    Currently Own: Nothing. I play mostly online now.

  14. The following 2 users say "Thanks" to Sederien


  15. #30
    Pachi Puro KimbaWLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    JUST outside Philadephia Pennsylvania
    Posts
    2,651
    Thanks
    5,022
    Thanks Received
    2,457

    Default Re: Sederien's Collected Pachinko Impressions (and General Q/A Thread)

    That works for me! I do try to get heavy versions most of the time but it was hard enough finding that one at the time for a good price.
    As ALWAYS thanks for the insight and knowledge, it really does help!
    I may not be the best guy, BUT I am not the bad guy!- Coop from Megas XLR

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 12
    Last Post: 11-14-2012, 01:25 PM
  2. My first Palot Impressions
    By fhagar in forum Modern Pachinko
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 05-29-2006, 06:29 PM
  3. How are the balls collected in parlours?
    By Dogg Thang in forum Modern Pachinko
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 12-07-2005, 09:34 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •