Different payout specs, same machine

[sppt76]

Hello all,

I am back, its been awhile. Thinking of getting another machine, but not sure which one to get.

The only difference between them is the payout specs/odds; like the special edition, light version, sweet version, etc.

Is it better to get the normal one, or get one with better odds but less payout. I am leaning toward one with the better odds, since it is for home use.

This will be like my 20th modern machine but never got one based on the odds before. Just like to get some input on the subject.

I have tried searching the site, but couldn't find that much info.

thanks

[Steve Cebu]

This is an area I have spent a lot of time researching.
Basically these machines are for gambling (of a sort) in parlors and
the odds determine the payout.
Higher odds machines that had an odds of 1/299.5
will payout generally less small bonses. But when you hit the jackpot
which is much harder to do you will get a much bigger payout and
depending on the machine it can actually assist in going into Fever
mode more often.
I can do a breakdown of an odds chart as well as an odds chart and what it means if you are
interested.

[naha13]

An odds chart for the different machines would make a nice sticky!

[Steve Cebu]

I'll try my best to explain it.
I'll use PachinkoVista.com since their layout is standard for all the machines they review.
Next to the description for the machine is a model # for the cell.
I'm going to use
ＣＲ南国育ちｉｎ沖縄９ＡＷ
and
ＣＲ南国育ちｉｎ沖縄Ｍ７ＡＸ

CR just means Credit so you can ignore that.
The Cells (in this case) are named 9AW and M7AX. Each cell generally, but not always has a different picture.


The specs below are for the M7AX as it appears on the website

基本スペック

	賞球数		3&10&13
	通常時大当たり確率		1/273.1
	確変時大当たり確率		1/27.3
	確変スペック		70％
	平均出玉		5R：約520個 15R：約1560個
	ラウンド・カウント数		5or15R/8C
	ラウンド振り分け		5R通常：9.0％ 15R通常：21.0％ 5R確変：21.0％ 15R確変：49.0％
	時短		全ての大当たり終了後9or17or100回

This is the translateed version of the same cell specs

Basic specs

	賞球数 The number of awards ball		3&10&13 3 & 10 & 13
	通常時大当たり確率 Usually hit probability when		1/273.1 1/273.1
	確変時大当たり確率 Hit probability when 確変		1/27.3 1/27.3
	確変スペック 確変 specs		70％ 70%
	平均出玉 The average ball		5R：約520個 5R: approximately 520 15R：約1560個 15R: about 1560 pieces
	ラウンド・カウント数 Count the number of rounds		5or15R/8C 5or15R/8C
	ラウンド振り分け Sorting round		5R通常：9.0％ Usually 5R: 9.0% 15R通常：21.0％ Usually 15R: 21.0% 5R確変：21.0％ 21.0%: 5R 確変 15R確変：49.0％ 49.0%: 15R 確変
	時短 Shorter working hours		全ての大当たり終了後9or17or100回 After the jackpot of all time 9or17or100

For a home user this has little meaning but basically how often you win the jackpot of bonus rrounds as well
as how stingy the machine is are indicated.
In this case you can win after you hit the jackpot pretty easily and your max payout is 1560 balls in 15 rounds.
15R, 5R = Rounds during a fever or bonus or jackpot round, as I understand it.
The percentages are pretty easy to figure out. But if you don't want to bother you can just look at a pie chart
showing your bonus rounds.



This shows you can hit 15R - 5R - 15R and 5Round Fevers or Bonuses and the percentage for it.

Ok so what makes a cell different let's look at the 9AW Cell for the same machine.
Keep in mind that all the different versons are generally different odds.
Sweet/Lite/Premium etc... There could also be other differences depending on the company
making the machine.
Higher odd machines seem to be produced first with better odds machines coming in later.
Sometimes they are made at the exact same time. Again this depends on teh company making the
machine.

Now let's look at the 9AW cell which in this case was released a couple of moths later.

基本スペック

	賞球数		3&10&12
	通常時大当たり確率		1/99.9
	確変時大当たり確率		1/20.6
	確変スペック		100％
	平均出玉		5R：約480個 15R：約1440個
	ラウンド・カウント数		5or15R/8C
	ラウンド振り分け		2R出玉ナシ：16％ 5R：53％ 15R：31％
	時短		全ての大当たり終了後９or17or100回

English Version
Basic specs

	賞球数 The number of awards ball		3&10&12 3 & 10 & 12
	通常時大当たり確率 Usually hit probability when		1/99.9 1/99.9
	確変時大当たり確率 Hit probability when 確変		1/20.6 1/20.6
	確変スペック 確変 specs		100％ Hundred percent
	平均出玉 The average ball		5R：約480個 5R: approximately 480 15R：約1440個 15R: about 1440
	ラウンド・カウント数 Count the number of rounds		5or15R/8C 5or15R/8C
	ラウンド振り分け Sorting round		2R出玉ナシ：16％ : 16% without the ball out of 2R 5R：53％ 5R: 53% 15R：31％ 15R: 31%
	時短 Shorter working hours		全ての大当たり終了後９or17or100回 After the jackpot of all time 9or17or100

Here is the Pie Chart



As you can see you have less of a chance to hit it big with this machine, but you will hit more often.
Ad you can see the Max payout is 1440 balls and you will hit that less than on the M7AX cell.
You now have a 2R jackpot instead of a 5R and only one 15 Round jackpot instead of two 15R jackpots.

If you play these at home it pretty much means you will hit the bonus more often but you will not
win as big which for most of us is not important.
If hitting a BIG FEVER with thousands of balls is more important then buy the higher odds machines.

If you look at each of the spec sheets it will say "Shorter Working Hours"
My guess is this is the time required to hit the bonus/jackpot/fever rounds.

Also you can hit a bonus or jackpot within a fever round I believe that is the "sorting round".

Companies can make 5-6 versions of the same machine. In this case there is only two cells.

I'm still trying to figure out all the way they breakdown the odds but unlike a Pachislo where
the odds are configurable. To change the odds you either need a different cell or bend the
nails or both.

This is all about the machines payouts which if you play in a Parlor matter a lot because you will
either go home with nothing or potentially hit it big.

If you want to know what odds your modern machine is, look on the inside rim of the cell.
there will be lettering and you will see something like 1/299.5 that's the odds for that machine at a glance.
You do not need to o[en teh door. These numbers have to be visible and it will also list the Cell model #

My Julie Pinball for example has 1/387.8 and it's Cell SF-T1
So when you hit it big on the Julie you really hit it BIG because the odds are stacked against you more than
if it was say 1/95.6.
You can alo look up the model on various websites like PachinkoVista or even better the companies website
and find out the odds.

Most of us just get whatever machine is available or we pick the one with the better cell picture. however if you want
huge payouts and invest in a ball lifter then go for the higher odds machines.
Big #'s = Big Payouts (when you hit)

I'm still figuring a lot of this stuff out, I'm still learning. I hope this is of some help.

[yose]

That's great info steve.Like you said whatever machine we can get a hold of is what you get as far as odds go.I just go for a machine that looks good to me,the rest takes care of itself.I myself just bend the nails to increase the odds ,or even remove some nails to make it easier to hit lower pockets.Winning on a home machine is just the entertainment excitement,not the gambling factor of winning.Thanks again for the breakdown on the translations.It explained alot of questions I had

[Threepwood]

Excellent job, Steve! I vote for sticky.

[Steve Cebu]

Thanks
Just keep in mind those odds are the ones that determine what you get for videos as well as Jackpots.
Bending the nails will get you more or less balls in the start pocket but the odds after that are as listed
in the specs. Every machine has different specs.
I'm more than happy to list the odds for each machine if someone asks about a specific machine.
Older machines can be tough to get specs on but not impossible.

My "Wanted" pachinko machine when you hit a fever, can hit a fever within a fever.
You end up shoveling so many balls from the winning tray to the hopper that it's unreal.
I always wondered how the people in the parlors had all those full trays of balls.
Now I know.

For reference the Sankyo "wanted" has odds of 1/356.3 There is another set of odds that says 1/2
I have to transfer the characters to figure out what those odds are for but they play an
important part because my other machines have drastically different numbers.

So buy a low odds machine without worrying. High Odds just means less payouts but
when you hit it'll be BIG!

[hanabi]

Btw The odds for some pachinkos can be found in our Research Centre, here is the link to 2 versions of Sankyo's 2002 'wanted' pachinko

PachiTalk Research Center - Sankyo - Wanted - PachiTalk

[Steve Cebu]

That offers the raw specs. I was trying to offer an explanation of what those specs mean.
It's a good resource tho.

[Jon]

I wouldn't mind knowing for my Jaws machine the other day when I played it, the bonos/jackpot went crazy had multiple fevers within another and played it for an hour in that mode and then went away and came back and it still wanted to keep giving me more and more!
I also wouldn't mind knowing for the star wars one aswell seeing that I will have this tomorrow

[Drunkenclam]

ZF spec

[sppt76]

So I shouldn't worry about the odds that much. One of the versions changes the cell a little; and has an odds of 1/297.9. While the original has odds at 1/368.2.

[Threepwood]

... I also wouldn't mind knowing for the star wars one aswell seeing that I will have this tomorrow

Here are the specs for your Star Wars. Look under the ZF listing.

[Threepwood]

ZF spec

Shouldn't you update your machine listing?

[Steve Cebu]

Ok this is most likely the one you have

ＣＲぱちんこジョーズＲ８０ＴＦ１

The number of awards ball		3&4&10&13 3 & 4 & 10 & 13
	通常時大当り確率 Normal probability jackpot		1/397 1/397
	確変時大当り確率 Probability jackpot when 確変		1/39.7 1/39.7
	確変スペック 確変 specs		80％ 80%
	平均出玉 The average ball		5R：約530個 5R: approximately 530 15R：約1600個 15R: about 1600
	ラウンド・カウント数 Count the number of rounds		5or15Ｒ/9C 5or15R/9C
	時短 Shorter working hours		全ての大当たり終了後80回 80 times after the end of all jackpot

Which Star Wars? There are two I know of. One is with R2D2 and the other is with Darth Vader.

[yose]

It's funny how the odds vary from one machine to the next,and the payout ratios also.Take for instance super sea story has 15 rounds per jackpot,where hyper passion only has 4 rounds per jackpot,All in all hyper passion pays out more balls in the long run as long as it doesn't hit a green 4 or 9 it keeps hitting winning bonuses.I have hit up to 38 bouses in a row,as the super sea story has hit only 17 in a row.My tenka getter hideyoshi has only hit11.Sea story is 1/359 tenka is1/350 hyper p. is 1/249.Inever payed much attention to the odds before,but a serius player would check the odds before playing.

[Steve Cebu]

That's because there is more going on here than the flat out odds.
All the other columns that you see listed affect the payouts as well.
So it's quite a bit of info you have to sift through to figure out how
the jackpots are affected.
You also have what they call "specs" and "hit probability when"
Also every machine has written on the cell another number near
the odds and it's written with a slash like 1/2 or 66/100
I believe those are the percentages.
This is why you have a machine that hits over and over versus one that hits less.
I also think this has to do with the "shorter working hours" column.
Once I get some newer machines I'll be able to test this out a bit more.
This is all a work in progress for me.

[candyflip]

I'll fill in all the gaps for you shortly Steve - just doing some other work right now.

[MrGneiss]

For home use I'm not sure how many people care about if a bonus pays out 1200 vs 2000..the reason I usually recommend getting the regular version of a game is because of people posting here after unknowingly ending up with a lite version of a popular game and wondering why they aren't seeing things that they've read about or seen in videos..

Of course with all the thousands of games and most games coming in 2-4 or even more specs not all machines will very enough between specs for most people to notice, but I'd say if you had the chance to get different specs of the machine you want that getting the regular spec is just the safest bet at getting what you want if all you really know about a machine is from promo videos and stuff..

Of course if you know a certain spec has things you want or a cell graphic you want then of course get that one..

But as others have said if you find your dream machine and its in a weird spec and its the only one you can get, just get it no matter what the spec and have fun with your Rad new pachi!!

[Drunkenclam]

Shouldn't you update your machine listing?

I don't know what you mean