Starting the game

[Mrtoad]

I know a very silly question but is there more than one way to begin a game? I have not played mine in probably 30 years or longer but if I remember correctly the way we started a game was to open the door and drop a ball in a pocket (or 2) to feed you a certain amount of balls to start with. Is there another mechanism to start it?

Thanks
Mike

[Moparformances]

starting with the tulips open will get ya more balls to play.. how ya start is relly unimportant... keep in mind that in japan the machine is never open for the player.. i would almost guarantee that in japan the tulips were always closed.. an open tulip is to easy to leave and not score..

i have my personal machines adjusted to pay as close to 100% as possable.. that way it keep players interested and i dont have to move balls as often..

[DukeOfDelmar]

If I'm understanding correctly, you are asking how to give a starting amount of balls to a player.

In a pachinko parlor setting, a player would have acquired their balls from an attendant, a separate machine, or one of the newer "Card Reader" pachinko machines. Thus the older machines do not come with a convenient "Start" button.

In a home setting, there are a few ways I can think of that you could go.
1. Keep a separate stash of balls for starting play, and replenish this stash from the balls that come out the bottom of the machine. This would be closest to what the parlors do.
2. Grab a few from the top payout hopper
3. For my Nishijin Model A, I know by feel the exact levers to move to force a manual payout, so I just reach around the back. On that machine it's a matter of moving one lever horizontally, which then allows another lever to be pulled down. Not really any different than dropping a ball in a pocket, except it doesn't require opening the door.

[Mrtoad]

starting with the tulips open will get ya more balls to play.. how ya start is relly unimportant... keep in mind that in japan the machine is never open for the player.. i would almost guarantee that in japan the tulips were always closed.. an open tulip is to easy to leave and not score..

i have my personal machines adjusted to pay as close to 100% as possable.. that way it keep players interested and i dont have to move balls as often..

thanks for for the reply. When you say adjusted to pay close to 100% as possible, do you mean having the pins straighter to allow easier access to the pockets or do you mean something else with the mechanics of the machine?


thanks again,
Mike

[Mrtoad]

If I'm understanding correctly, you are asking how to give a starting amount of balls to a player.

In a pachinko parlor setting, a player would have acquired their balls from an attendant, a separate machine, or one of the newer "Card Reader" pachinko machines. Thus the older machines do not come with a convenient "Start" button.

In a home setting, there are a few ways I can think of that you could go.
1. Keep a separate stash of balls for starting play, and replenish this stash from the balls that come out the bottom of the machine. This would be closest to what the parlors do.
2. Grab a few from the top payout hopper
3. For my Nishijin Model A, I know by feel the exact levers to move to force a manual payout, so I just reach around the back. On that machine it's a matter of moving one lever horizontally, which then allows another lever to be pulled down. Not really any different than dropping a ball in a pocket, except it doesn't require opening the door.

Thanks for the reply. I was not sure if there was a lever meant to pull in the back to do a manual payout and sounds like there is. I might do the separate stash thing as I plan on building a case for it so reaching around back would not be possible and would require opening it which I know I will need to do on occasion but prefer not to do for each game.

Thanks,
Mike

[Moparformances]

thanks for for the reply. When you say adjusted to pay close to 100% as possible, do you mean having the pins straighter to allow easier access to the pockets or do you mean something else with the mechanics of the machine?


thanks again,
Mike

nail adjusting... theres a lot to nail adjusting.. we have all seen the two nails next to the tulip or pocket bent out.. or worse yet the people who remove nails... (ill never understand that one)..

get yourself a ball adjusting set and make minor adjustments.. and keep in mind that the pins 2 or 3 rows above the pockets will effect the ball just as much as the last two next to the pocket..

tweek small amounts one the nails bending them away from the paokets.. but dont bend any nail so much that a ball will get stuck on the oppisit side.. then play the machine and see how it pays.. some machines require little adjustments.. some require allot..

nail bender and gap tool.jpggap tool.jpgnail bender.jpg

allot of the time i just use my fingers to adjust but the ball tool really helps

[tvterry]

nail adjusting... theres a lot to nail adjusting.. we have all seen the two nails next to the tulip or pocket bent out.. or worse yet the people who remove nails... (ill never understand that one)..

get yourself a ball adjusting set and make minor adjustments.. and keep in mind that the pins 2 or 3 rows above the pockets will effect the ball just as much as the last two next to the pocket..

tweek small amounts one the nails bending them away from the paokets.. but dont bend any nail so much that a ball will get stuck on the oppisit side.. then play the machine and see how it pays.. some machines require little adjustments.. some require allot..

nail bender and gap tool.jpggap tool.jpgnail bender.jpg

allot of the time i just use my fingers to adjust but the ball tool really helps

I for one have not learned how to adjust the nails to get better scores. I have a Nishijin B machine. I did what you said you don't understand. I removed 1 nail above the tulups on the right and left side. Remember, JUST ONE NAIL... I still only get one payout in about 12 to 15 balls. I figure it is my machine and I am the only one using it. The nails can be replaced.

I got the idea from a video on the Vintage Pachiko site. He removed 1 nail above the right and the left tulup for a customer to make it pay better. Again, it is my machine. I haven't killed it. All the nails are the same as they were when I got the machine. I have the nails I pulled taped in the back.

Now if I have commited a major sin, I am sorry. The machine works. I only pulled 2 nails. On the other hand, bending nails seems more wrong than what I did. The only time I have ever moved a nail is if a ball gets stuck. End of story...

tvterry, the old guy from WV...

[DukeOfDelmar]

I for one have not learned how to adjust the nails to get better scores. I have a Nishijin B machine. I did what you said you don't understand. I removed 1 nail above the tulups on the right and left side. Remember, JUST ONE NAIL... I still only get one payout in about 12 to 15 balls. I figure it is my machine and I am the only one using it. The nails can be replaced.

I got the idea from a video on the Vintage Pachiko site. He removed 1 nail above the right and the left tulup for a customer to make it pay better. Again, it is my machine. I haven't killed it. All the nails are the same as they were when I got the machine. I have the nails I pulled taped in the back.

Now if I have commited a major sin, I am sorry. The machine works. I only pulled 2 nails. On the other hand, bending nails seems more wrong than what I did. The only time I have ever moved a nail is if a ball gets stuck. End of story...

tvterry, the old guy from WV...

Hey, its your machine, and I doubt modding it however you want will have any permanent impact on your immortal soul, and we're easygoing enough to respect both purists and modders.

I'd consider nail bending to be normal maintenance. The pachinko parlors check and bend nails regularly using the same adjusting tools Moparperformances posted pictures of, because the nails do eventually bend anyway under the constant assault of dense, gravity-accelerated steel balls. I just don't go nuts and try to put something crazy like a 10 or 15 degree bend. 1 or 2 degrees, if that, is all it takes.

I find much of the trick to nail-bending is to make a wider gap for a ball to deflect into rather than around. It really is an art, though. Depending on position, fully removing a nail may make it harder to deflect a ball into a pocket rather than easier.

I've also found nail bending to have the most effect on payout if the machine is either totally level front-to-back or ever so slightly tilted forward (but not so much that balls stall at the bottom). When you think about it, this makes sense since the further forward in the playfield, the more the angle of the nail shifts the position of the shaft away from the original position.

[Mrtoad]

nail adjusting... theres a lot to nail adjusting.. we have all seen the two nails next to the tulip or pocket bent out.. or worse yet the people who remove nails... (ill never understand that one)..

get yourself a ball adjusting set and make minor adjustments.. and keep in mind that the pins 2 or 3 rows above the pockets will effect the ball just as much as the last two next to the pocket..

tweek small amounts one the nails bending them away from the paokets.. but dont bend any nail so much that a ball will get stuck on the oppisit side.. then play the machine and see how it pays.. some machines require little adjustments.. some require allot..

nail bender and gap tool.jpggap tool.jpgnail bender.jpg


allot of the time i just use my fingers to adjust but the ball tool really helps

thank you very much for the information. Do you happen to have any links on where to get them?

Mike

[tvterry]

Hey, its your machine, and I doubt modding it however you want will have any permanent impact on your immortal soul, and we're easygoing enough to respect both purists and modders.

I'd consider nail bending to be normal maintenance. The pachinko parlors check and bend nails regularly using the same adjusting tools Moparperformances posted pictures of, because the nails do eventually bend anyway under the constant assault of dense, gravity-accelerated steel balls. I just don't go nuts and try to put something crazy like a 10 or 15 degree bend. 1 or 2 degrees, if that, is all it takes.

I find much of the trick to nail-bending is to make a wider gap for a ball to deflect into rather than around. It really is an art, though. Depending on position, fully removing a nail may make it harder to deflect a ball into a pocket rather than easier.

I've also found nail bending to have the most effect on payout if the machine is either totally level front-to-back or ever so slightly tilted forward (but not so much that balls stall at the bottom). When you think about it, this makes sense since the further forward in the playfield, the more the angle of the nail shifts the position of the shaft away from the original position.

I am not a purist or a modder. I am just having fun with my machine. I should have kept my mouth shut. All that I was doing was trying to tell why someone might remove a nail or two. I removed 2 measly nails on my machine. I had no part in this post, and will not have further involvment. I was just trying to get a point across, and I guess I did wrong. I apologise to the O.P.

tvterry

[Mrtoad]

I am not a purist or a modder. I am just having fun with my machine. I should have kept my mouth shut. All that I was doing was trying to tell why someone might remove a nail or two. I removed 2 measly nails on my machine. I had no part in this post, and will not have further involvment. I was just trying to get a point across, and I guess I did wrong. I apologise to the O.P.

tvterry

No need to apologize to me, it did not bother me...

Mike

[DukeOfDelmar]

I am not a purist or a modder. I am just having fun with my machine. I should have kept my mouth shut. All that I was doing was trying to tell why someone might remove a nail or two. I removed 2 measly nails on my machine. I had no part in this post, and will not have further involvment. I was just trying to get a point across, and I guess I did wrong. I apologise to the O.P.

tvterry

No worries here, either. I hope that I did not offend with my (potentially over-)enthusiastic sharing of knowledge. I apologize if my words conveyed anything other than an earnest desire to share and strike up a conversation.

[Mrtoad]

No worries here, either. I hope that I did not offend with my (potentially over-)enthusiastic sharing of knowledge. I apologize if my words conveyed anything other than an earnest desire to share and strike up a conversation.

No offense to me . Sharing your views and knowledge is a good thing

[RivkahChaya]

If I'm understanding correctly, you are asking how to give a starting amount of balls to a player.

...snip...

In a home setting, there are a few ways I can think of that you could go.
1. Keep a separate stash of balls for starting play, and replenish this stash from the balls that come out the bottom of the machine. This would be closest to what the parlors do.
2. Grab a few from the top payout hopper
3. For my Nishijin Model A, I know by feel the exact levers to move to force a manual payout, so I just reach around the back. On that machine it's a matter of moving one lever horizontally, which then allows another lever to be pulled down. Not really any different than dropping a ball in a pocket, except it doesn't require opening the door.

More specifically, move the seesaw to the down right, or "payout" position, then push down the "dispenser" rod, the rod that a ball would push down if the seesaw had actually been tipped by a ball. If your seesaw cover is on (a lot of machines lose them along the way) you can take the screw out, and use a cotter pin to make a latch, so it comes on and off easily, and provides the dust protection it's there for, but doesn't require you to unscrew the thing eah time you want a manual payout. You can also push down the dispenser rod with the seesaw up, and the balls will go into the used box (on a non-A model). Take them out, and put them in the play tray.

nail adjusting... theres a lot to nail adjusting.. we have all seen the two nails next to the tulip or pocket bent out.. or worse yet the people who remove nails... (ill never understand that one)..

I set up a machine for my son, when he was six. He plays pretty haphazardly, and likes to hit the center, but isn't skilled enough to aim, so I took to nails out, and put one in another spot. I got the machine to average about one hit per 15 balls, and get a lot of center hits even with random shooting (it has a nice center, with several different animations). I got it on eBay advertised as "non-working," for "parts or repair." It was in better shape than it sounded, but most of the wires, and a socket were gone, and the leaf springs were mangled, plus, I had to improvise a few broken pieces with cotter pins, or fabrication with Fimo (modeling polymer that bakes to hardness in a conventional oven), because it had things that were always popping out of place. There was a long crack in the top hopper tray (it's a Sophia B), so I drilled it at the end to stop it from cracking further, made a Fimo plug, which I glued in with modeling cement, and then glued the crack, and made a thin fitted Fimo patch over the place where the crack began, with two drilled holes on either side to hold it in place, and glued that on after I baked it. It seems to be as strong as ever.

So it wasn't like this machine was ever going to be pristine. It barely has any chrome on the front, and I'm thinking of sanding it, and painting it whatever color the boychik wants. I never would have hot-rodded a machine that was close to mint condition. As it was, I put LEDs and 9V batteries in it, so it has extra lights, and doesn't plug into the wall. No chance of shock from exposed wires, and it's more portable. The pay-out lights, and the tray-empty lights are on two different circuits.

I hate it when someone chops up a nice vintage car that looks like it just came from the factory, but when someone rescues a rust-rod, or demo car, and then makes a fun toy out of it, so what?

[Moparformances]

seems my words were taken to heart.. its just my opinon that removing a nail is not necessary.. and i dont understand why people do it.. just a simple statement..

geting one jackpot for every 13 to 15 balls is the exact target number im looking for...

not trying to call anyone out or say anything negative...

sorry to have offended any one who has or would pull a nail

[mxfaiman]

It really is an art, though. Depending on position, fully removing a nail may make it harder to deflect a ball into a pocket rather than easier.

I've also found nail bending to have the most effect on payout if the machine is either totally level front-to-back or ever so slightly tilted forward (but not so much that balls stall at the bottom). When you think about it, this makes sense since the further forward in the playfield, the more the angle of the nail shifts the position of the shaft away from the original position.

There is an art to bending nails. That is why there is the job of kugushi (nail bender) in parlors. The trick is trying to get all nails to line up straight yet have minor differences that most players won't notice at first. Also from the factory all the nails on the playfield should be between 3-5 degrees off of 90 (when we replace playfields we try to get them all at 4 degrees). We have handy little gauges that tell us the angle of the nail and height of nail. Which are both very important. Also your tools are very handy to have. We have a special pair of plyers we bought that are designed only for nail bending and we also have a 2 sided ball gauge. One side of the gauge is about .5mm smaller than a pachinko ball (11mm) and the other end is .5mm larger. The gauge is the key to getting everything right. As when we do machines we set them "loose" meaning we only use the larger end of the gauge and adjust all the nails to fit that size. This way it makes it really fun for the player. But you do have to have a keen eye to figure out how to bend it. (also have to figure about rebound off other nails.)

Also from my experience due to the way some machines are set up they just don't payout often. As the pockets might not open one another or the center feature is really hard to win on. But a majority of the time it is all about how you bend the nails.

[Moparformances]

thank you very much for the information. Do you happen to have any links on where to get them?

Mike

made a quick search but no luck... sorry

i got mine on da-bay a few years back

[mxfaiman]

thank you very much for the information. Do you happen to have any links on where to get them?

Mike

We got ours directly from Japan. If you want here is the store we bought them from but I don't think they ship.

Ball Gauage
Nail Gauge
Nail Pliers

003.jpg004.jpg (sorry don't have any pics of our other tools at the moment)

Oh and nice tools aren't cheap. Just so you know.

[RivkahChaya]

seems my words were taken to heart.. its just my opinon that removing a nail is not necessary.. and i dont understand why people do it.. just a simple statement..

geting one jackpot for every 13 to 15 balls is the exact target number im looking for...

Ideally you get that through practice, but the machines were made for adult play, not for children. I've been playing since I was 12, and I'm 46. I can place a marble pretty well, after playing a machine for a little while. I'm pretty bloody good at pinball as well. Like I said, I rigged the machine for my 7-year-old. He'll get bored, eventually, and want to play a more challenging machine, after he gains some skill.

We got ours directly from Japan. If you want here is the store we bought them from but I don't think they ship.

Ball Gauage
Nail Gauge
Nail Pliers
Oh and nice tools aren't cheap. Just so you know.

This is just a guess, but it might be possible to use the tool that bicycle mechanics use for straightening spokes to straighten nails. I've never done it. I use a little hammer that is from a toy tool set my brother had as a child, but is actually metal and wood, along with small pliers from a set of computer tools. I'm sure it wouldn't be good enough for a parlor in Japan; this is just personal use. I didn't buy any of those tools just for this-- already had them around. I also use a feeler gauge from a set of old car tools for setting spark plug gaps to check the angle. I always went for 90'. But the machine always ends up leaning back ever so slightly (I guess they are front heavy, though you wouldn't think so), so the nails are 90' from the cell, but not parallel to the floor, if that makes sense.

[mxfaiman]

I always went for 90'. But the machine always ends up leaning back ever so slightly (I guess they are front heavy, though you wouldn't think so), so the nails are 90' from the cell, but not parallel to the floor, if that makes sense.

Makes perfect sense but the nails are about 4 degrees off of 90 from the playfield. The machine itself should have about a 3-5 degree lean backwards as well.