is there money to be made

[marniebattle]

I have to do a buiness project for school.

Now I have looked at the cost of unfinished machines of the boat and avarged it out to be 60$ machine and 20$ worth of refurbishing with labor
makeing it 80$ us a machine. Most machines sold in retail like a mall or flee market sell for alot more because of implusive buyers, machines on ebay sell for alot less because of compitition. Im thinking of an extra income buiness have one store in the mall and also sell on ebay. Have the other stock in public storage. Would it be wrong to assume that i would be selling 5 machines avarage a week in a popular south florida mall and even more around the holiday season. I would sell the premimum machines at a high price in the mall and sell the less popular machines off on ebay like most vendors. Im i off by assuming i would make 40k a year after all overhed is paid off.

Im 14 years old so im not really looking to open one for a long time however Is pachislo a fad in the US or is it here to stay and IS THER A MARKET FOR THEASE MACHINES

I really would appreciate feedback from pro vendors but if you would like to be conselealed about it please pm me, i will not post any thing with your name unless permitted.


thanks

[drcrippen324]

dont forget on top of buying and refurbing you got stall rental income or buisness tax transport from storage to mall and back also you have to factor in dead on arrival machines as they do happen and you use them for spares also there is having the knowledge to offer a backup service if they break after it is purchased and transformers for some models that are running 24v it be a lot more to it than wipeing with a rag and calling it refurbed and selling it

[marniebattle]

i think i was quite generous in factoring 80$ a machine it is some $$ cheper i now relize but will i make good $$$

[rupan777]

IS THER A MARKET FOR THEASE MACHINES

Look at the members' list on the site; there's your market.

Seriously, I think there's always a market for entertainment-based hobbies but I wouldn't expect to be living large on the profits.

[slotter]

Will the U.S market become saturated in future years as more importers bring the machines over to the states? Is saturation what we saw this Christmas when the machines brought lower prices than in past years?

Questions that need to be answered.

[Lddrizzt]

And what about the Sam's Club, Ollies, or any other store out accross the parking lot? CHeck your market area and make sure they aren't nearby already for sale.
Don't forget to repaint them too so you got paint expense also. Plus you are gonna have to hire someone to transport them for you, you ain't old enough to drive yet.

[marniebattle]

in ten years ill be laughing
lol

[slotter]

You gotta love that 14 year old optimism! Go for it, marnie, and I sincerely do hope you will be laughing!

[jibs]

Sure there is money to be made, but it's not going to happen over night. First thing - mall rent is expensive. Cheap retail space where I am in the midwest will run $2000 a month.
If you are selling in a mall, you have to put the 40' container your slots arrive in somewhere. You'll have to put 400+ slots somewhere - probably a seperate shop (=more rent) away from the mall. If your shop isn't big enough to store them all and still allow you to work on machines, you'll be paying rent to the shipping container people of a couple hundred a month to keep the container on site.
So you are getting machines for roughly $80 each with refurb, etc. A 40' container with 480 machines costs you $38k. You sell 5 a week. You make say, $200 PROFIT on each machine (not likely). You will be selling machines for a year just to break even. You haven't made a single dime on your investment. Everything you make goes to pay rent and to recoup the 38k you spent to buy the machines in the first place. After a year of selling 5 per week you'll have sold all the cool stuff and need to buy another container...
You sell the non-popular Japanese titles (about 15- 20% of your container) on ebay. Because you can't sell a low end machine on ebay for anywhere near $80 bucks you have to skimp on refurb. You sell a cruddy machine to a guy from this board, and he spreads the word..."beware"

Just my .02. I do know this - I sold 9 machines from my garage last week and I am not about to quit my day job!

[bf_of_pf]

And don't forget tokens. The machines off the boat don't come with tokens. That adds to the cost because you can't sell a machine without any tokens.

[the-pachinko-master!]

I always think its best not to buy pachinko's for profit. Sometimes you come out alright but there are many machines that don't bring much and you are lucky to break even. Plus,to make a lot of money on them you almost have to ship them surface and you can have a lot of money tied up for up to two months waiting on them. Floor space at a mall would be a bad idea. Way to much overhead. You would have to sell a lot of machines just to pay the rent. But don't get me wrong though,it could be done with a website or ebay or build up your trust on a site like this but it would be a lot of work for a 14 year old. But this is the good old USA,anything is possable!

[cwstnsko]

It's a tough business, I think you'd need to do it on a pretty big scale to clear $40K/year.

Don't forget the cost of tokens. You'll have to put $20 worth of tokens with your $80 machine and I wouldn't plan on getting more than $150 on average.

Didn't you sell your Marine Battle recently? How much of a market was there for it? How much money did you make on it?

I bought about 70 machines right before the holidays. These machines had been refurbed, painted and prepped for shipment by the previous owner. I got them VERY cheap, I sell them out of my garage, so I have no overhead. I've sold about half of them so far and I have my investment back, but I have very little to show for my time (except a Spin-Luck )

If I had paid $80 each, I wouldn't break even for at least a year. I paid less than half that much per machine and it's still not a cash cow. Around the holidays, they were selling as fast as I could polish and box them. Now, I sell about 2 per week.

[Tulsa]

Which is why we do not sell machines on this site. We are collectors, we leave the selling to those who do it best.

[aaapachislo]

$20 for labor is a bit much for one machine. We recently started in this business and let me tell you, it is HARD work. I usually work around 10 hours a days 6 days a week, and have 2 full time employees and 1 part time. I will start selling a lot more on eBay in the next 2 weeks. Somethings to think about before you get started, mainly a storage unit isnt going to come even close to being big enough for 400 machines. We have 1500 sq. ft. with 160 machines and there isnt a lot of free room at all. We are picking up a 26' truck of about 150 machines weekly so I or my employees spend 2 days a week driving a truck. ( I am getting pretty good at it )

Hate to tell you but you wont come close to making 40k a year only selling 5 machines a week, you would actually need to sell about 25-30 a week to do that with VERY little overhead.

Dont get down though, a lot of people are saying some machines sell for under 80, but not that much, and some machines sell for well over $80. If you get a good mix of machines you will end up with a decent profit.

Hey if you are in Florida and have someone who wants to drive you up to my warehouse I will be more than happy to get you started so you dont have to buy 400 machines. I am in Bradenton/Sarasota.

[cwstnsko]

That's funny, I would have thought $20 per machine for labor to be quite low. Unless I were using Illegal immigrant day-laborers, I'd have to pay about $12/hour for good help. A machine raw from the container will need to have stickers scraped, wood putty in holes, sanded, at least 1 coat of paint, most will need a transformer installed (another $10+ we haven't talked about), reels cleaned, hopper cleaned, inside cleaned, general exterior cleaning, clear plastic polished and/or scratch removal, chrome polished, coin mechanism cleaned, light bulbs checked and/or changed (more $$), tested for proper function (which on many machine means playing until a BB is hit to verify all of the features / lights work.)

If the machine came from a smoking casino, double the effort required for all of the above, and add de-odorizing.

I have many machines in my garage that I have put several hours of work into and I'll be lucky to clear $20 in profit when I sell them. That's why I don't do it for the money, I do it because I love saving pachis and I love sharing my hobby with others

[bf_of_pf]

And let's not forget about the volume controls. That's a service that a lot of vendors provide, which they usually add as an option for between $10 & $20, but some places (American Syscom, for example) include that in their base price for non-sale machines. On some machines it's a straight shot, so it's not very time intensive. But it still involves the cost of the controllers themselves, and the incidentals, like shrink tubing or something else to fuse the stripped wires together. Other machines involve a bit more work to enable clear access to the speaker wires. It all adds up in terms of time and materials.

[aaapachislo]

Wow $12 an hour is a lot more than I pay for my good help, so thats probably why it costs more. I agree with you though that you must do every single thing you have said, and then some! Not all machines take as long though, I can average about an hour a machine if it is in pretty good condition. Buy all my supplies in bulk so I save some money there. Not much but hey every dime counts!

[arbycoffee]

And you are going to do all this yourself, If you hire anyone, SS, Workmens comp, Unemployement, Withholding, an acountant.

And what about the junk machines ? the dead one, the over scratched ones. I have heard from strong sorces a 6 to 10% lose.

[Firewire]

One more thing to consider.......payment processing.....If you want a business account (which almost comes up as a necessity at some point in buying or selling) you have to either have a LLC or C corporation, etc to open the account at the bank.

Then once you have that (which is relatively cheap to start $50-$200) you have the issue of payment processing. You can't realistically only accept checks and cash, so you will need to be able to handle credit card processing. Especially for the high dollar machines you plan to sell at the mall. Ebay isn't a problem with Paypal, but retail brick and mortar stores pretty much willl have to have credit card processing. Easily a setup fee of $100-$200 then monthly service fee of $30-$50 plus each transaction will cost you 0.5%-3%. These are only my guesstimates, and maybe someone here will have a better insight on payment processing, but several years ago I looked into this side of the biz and thought wow!

So I would forget the Mall bit all together until you have established your business on ebay using Paypal (which also will cost you about 2.5-3% per sale). Open a yahoo store if you want too. Then advertise with Google. It is as cheap as $0.05 a click. You are taking a HUGE jump doing all this at once.

Another option at the mall are the carts in the middle. But again, I would learn your trade (the cost and refurbishment) before I jumped into a mall store. Adertise locally in the classifieds and craigslist too.

Don't mean to pee on your parade, but you need to see all angles.

SBA says 50% fail during first year
The U.S. Small Business Administration has seen lots of small businesses come and, unfortunately, go. According to the SBA, over 50% of small businesses fail in the first year and 95% fail within the first five years. Why? What goes wrong?

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1. Lack of experience

2. Insufficient capital (money)

3. Poor location

4. Poor inventory management

5. Over-investment in fixed assets

6. Poor credit arrangements

7. Personal use of business funds

8. Unexpected growth

Gustav Berle adds two more reasons in The Do It Yourself Business Book:

9. Competition

10. Low sales

These figures aren't meant to scare you, but to prepare you for the rocky path ahead.

Underestimating the difficulty of starting a business is one of the biggest obstacles entrepreneurs face. However, success can be yours if you are patient, willing to work hard, and take all the necessary steps.

On the Upside

It's true that there are many reasons not to start your own business. But for the right person, the advantages of business ownership far outweigh the risks.

You will be your own boss. Hard work and long hours directly benefit you, rather than increasing profits for someone else. Earning and growth potential are far greater. A new venture is as exciting as it is risky. Running a business provides endless challenge and opportunities for learning.

[Mike]

I think you've got to love the machines and what you're doing - I'd imagine the money is just a side issue. Look at someone like Arby. I'd always thought that it'd be something to do later in life - you've earned the money working in some crappy job, paid of a bit of the mortgage and then want to put the hard won cash into something you enjoy doing. Still, nothing wrong with dreaming and I wish you the best of luck!