I am confused....and somewhat new....excuse me....input needed

[glock2006]

i realize this site is completely anti-gambling, and so am i. The only gambling i have ever done was a scratch card that someone gave me. I don't intend to discuss gambling with this thread, only theory.
i am confused at how pachislo parlors profit.
is it because they sell the tokens and then give out prizes worth less than the $$$ spent to play:questionm
I read another thread written by a very successful pacislo/pachinko player who said he traded his balls/tokens in for cash.

if you can make a steady income playing in japan, does that mean that these machines ALWAYS take in more tokens than they spit out, over a span of time:questionm

If so, i don't understand the following: Everyone who is asked their opinion on quarter mods states that one of the reasons they are against it is because they wouldn't want someone to put in a few quarters and walk with 200. Theoretically, wouldn't this only happen on average once every more than 200 tokens inserted:questionm

Or is this because they just have their machines set very loosely:questionm

I really want to understand this fascinating hobby that is new to me, and i was told this is the place to go with questions.

Thanks in advance,
Newbie Paul

[RKnarr01]

Hi again and welcome,

In japan your purchase tokens then you can trade them in for either prizes or worthless tokens or other objects these other worthless object are often sold at nearby booths for cash and then the booths sell the items back to the parlor for money. They make money the same way american slots do take in more than they put out. Contact Azlew he has a great clip of a vid that shows how the theory works out.

[Tony Junior]

First, like anything to do with gambling, the house is always the winner, even though once in a while someone can win big. And I would guess that the prizes givven in Japan are much like the claw machines we see everywhere today. Cheap, but fun to play.

Don't forget, even here in the states there are professional gamblers. I suspect the saame in Japan.

The majority of PachiTalk members are of the opinion these machines are just for fun. They are legal as token machines in most states. To change them to quarters would make them illegal almost everywheree. Not only that, it takes about 1200 to 1500 tokens for each machine. Most of us have multiple machines. You do the math of how much each machine would need! (I have to hit the sack soon. ) There is one other thing, machines that have been converted to quarters very often have problems with the payout hopper. That small difference in size is critical. Besides, it is more fun to hit a lot of payouts, especially for your guests.

Not everything has been answered, but I hope that helps.

[rupan777]

I guess since I'm one of the few people lucky enough to have beaten the house in Japan that I should chime in now.

The way a payout works is that, by law, a pachinko parlor can not directly remit monetary cash prizes to customers, they can remit anything else, however (I've won a rice cooker, several video games, a shaver, and lots of food items before). So, if you win, the attendant will dump your balls/tokens into a counting machine that spits out a receipt, you go to the prize counter and tell them you will "exchange". BTW, exchange rates vary from parlor to parlor but, typically, a box of pachinko balls is 5000 yen and a big bonus-worth of pachislo tokens is about 6000 yen.

The attendant at the counter then gives you "chips". At this point, you will probably have to leave the building to a nearby storefront (usually a single service window) and exchange your chips for cash. Again, this storefront is usually near the parlor or it can be in the same building but not actually part of the parlor. They are technically "owned" by a different company than that of the parlor as well.

Now, can players make money out of pachinko? Yes and no. There are "pachi-pros" that can make thousands a month but I highly doubt that these people only play all day; many of them write for pachinko magazines, hold regular or part-time jobs, etc. The secret to winning in pachinko is data. I spent many hours mining and analyzing data sets, odds, reading magazines, etc. For something that is so fun and entertaining on the surface, it's actually very complex mathematically and, like all gambling, there is no one sure-thing.

Can parlors make money? Most definitely because, for every decent winner, you have 10 or 20 others who are burning their wallets away. Plus, you have to remember that the parlors also have control over changing odds on the machines. I'll just say you do not want to be playing during bonus season there.

[glock2006]

So if i understand correctly....

Each machine takes in more tokens than it spits out (overall), all the time.

Would that be a true statement:questionm

a-little-less-new-bie Paul
glock2006

[rupan777]

No, not always. A winning machine has tokens (or balls) in the player's favor.

[RKnarr01]

GLOCK,

some machines will payout more than they take in but all the machines in the parlor combined will take in more than they payout.

[glock2006]

ok, to revise.
is this true:
a machine set to odss of less than 100% percent will take in more than it pays out overall:questionm

paul

[rupan777]

It depends. A machine with odds of 100% has to take tokens/balls because it takes those items to use the machine and get the chance to win. Machines have different odds, pachinko usually being 1/410 and pachislo usually around 1/300. If these odds were flat, the machine would easily take more than it would give but there are built in features that machines have that let you link jackpots together. Check out item #7 in this thread I posted here, it might explain this idea a little better.

[glock2006]

ok...Related question:
I saw a site that has specs on the different machines and some percentages next to the numbers 1 thru 6 which i understand are skill settings. if wins are determined by a player's skill ("skill stop/skill slot") what do the percentages represent:questionm

Also, if the reels eventually stop by themselves, is it safe to assume there IS a random number generator in the machine? if so, doesn't that alone qualify it as a game of chance:questionm

Does this have anything to do with the percentages i saw:questionm

paul
glock2006

[RKnarr01]

those percentages are the payout percentage over 10,000 tokens i believe so if it says 106% it will payout 6% more than is being but in I believe. Rupan can probably confirm or correct this.

[rupan777]

That is roughly correct and, again, those are static specifications.

As for the reels, in parlors, they do not automatically stop (or shouldn't anyway). I believe it is Japanese law that all machines are to be directly controlled by the user, with certain exceptions. I've let reels spin while I took a break many times before and they were still going when I returned.

[arbycoffee]

Also you "rent" tokens (metals) or balls (spheres) for more than you get when you cash in.
IE 4 Yen per ball rent and cash in at 2 1/2 Yen. This will very for different reasons.

Most I think one would find play them for the fun and chance of winning prizes.

[chaz70]

As for the reels, in parlors, they do not automatically stop (or shouldn't anyway). I believe it is Japanese law that all machines are to be directly controlled by the user, with certain exceptions. I've let reels spin while I took a break many times before and they were still going when I returned.

The reels do stop, but it is after a good amount of time. Maybe 2 mins or so.
They do on my 3 pachislo machines anyway.

[slotter]

The reels on all my machines stop after about 60 seconds or so.

[rupan777]

Really? I'm sure I've walked away for a good 5-10 minutes to make a phone call and they were still going...maybe it depends on the manufacturer.

[RKnarr01]

all 12 or 13 of mine will stop their own reels withing 30 to 45 seconds of being started.

[rupan777]

Maybe JapNoodle can come and give us more information...someone, send up a signal.

[arbycoffee]

Because of the skill requierment in the pachinko parlors, they might be req. to not stop ?

[rupan777]

Because of the skill requierment in the pachinko parlors, they might be req. to not stop ?

Yeah, that's what I was picking up on but don't have anything to prove it. Plus, I don't even know if that's something that you can set the machine to do, not having my own and all...

That's also why most parlors are not allowed to set pachinko machines to "auto-shoot" if the handle is stopped.