Received My Token Dispenser

[Lddrizzt]

Here is a thought, is it possible to re-route the bill path to spit the bill out a slot instead of it going to the stacker? If you do that then you have your accurate count, and you don't have to keep opening the machine and no screwing up of the electronics.

[RKnarr01]

Lddrizzt,

I dont think so that would be quite hard.

[Lddrizzt]

It was just a thought, Working on printers and seeing how the paper paths can be changed easily I figured it might be a similar thing, where the bill would go through a curved path remove that section of plastic and replace it with a straight one.

[RKnarr01]

The thing that makes it hard is that these machines are so compact and if you ran the bill straight and had it come out the back of the machine you would have to run it through a bunch of wires.

[Lddrizzt]

then curve it to come out the front, that would most likely be prferable any way.
Which way does the bill go to the stacker? does it just drop in? curve back foward to go beneath the bill reader?
There has to be a path there somewhere, most likely you would have to make an adjustment to the stacker but that might be easier than messing with the electronics.
I know it would be for me cuz I suck at electronics.

[RKnarr01]

you put the bill in face down the it goes in and curves down into the stacker so that the bill is face up in the stacker. i know nothing about electronics either lddrizzt or i'd be trying to get it to work with a button.

[compirate]

You could make a new cover with a couple inch opening where the stacker is. The bills are very easily removed from the stacker.

This is the front acceptor/stacker cover:

http://compirate.home.mindspring.com...ures/Front.JPG

The top of the stack of bills is just below the '1000'. If you wanted, a new door could be made with a 2" slit there and the bills would easily accessable without opening the door all the time.


Door open:
http://compirate.home.mindspring.com...s/Dooropen.JPG

Bills partially pulled out of stacker:

http://compirate.home.mindspring.com...s/Billsout.JPG

[RKnarr01]

yea then you could just pull it out, but im a purist and it has to appear to be stock.

[compirate]

Well, as stated earlier, the hopper motor is just a regular motor (not a stepper that requires a special controller). As long as it's getting 24vdc it spits out tokens. A timer circuit (should be about $10-$15 in parts) would make it run for X seconds at the push of a button. Just set for whatever time spits out the amount of tokens you want. The only thing is no count display. If the acceptor and count circuitry were separate it would be easy to fool but with everything integrated (and the units 'rare' and expensive-don't want to fry 'sperimentin'), it isn't so easy. The acceptor and count are probably software (in the rom), it isn't as easy as a simple switch to tell it a bill is good. I think a motor controller/timer, bypassing all the circuitry (maybe using the built in power supply though) would be the cheapest, simplest way to go.

[RKnarr01]

i know i saw one of these machines in japan set to work with a button now i cant find where i saw it.

[logicprobe]

Without cutting anything yet, is it possible to trace the connections to that relay to see if it's controlling the motor for the acceptor, or the hopper?

[RKnarr01]

i got lost at the word relay maybe compirate can answer this!

[compirate]

Ok, here it is. Took out all the units and traced all the connectors.
For reference:
http://compirate.home.mindspring.com...s/P6170002.JPG
This is for the white connectors on the right side of the board top to bottom :
CN1
4 Power -
3 Power -
2 Power +
1 Power +

CN2
6 Hopper Motor -
5 Hopper Motor +
4 Red wire out back
3 Brn wire out back
2 Grey wire out back
1 White wire out back

CN3
1 Acceptor signals
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9

CN4
1 Token count sensor signals
2
3
4
5
6
7

Relay:

1 2
3

4 5


1,2,3 contacts
4,5 coil

5 - CN2-2
4 - some kind of smd transistor (A7s)
1 - No idea
2- CN2-1
3- CN2-2

The wires out (CN2, 1-4) are connectors out the back of the overall unit that have tags on them that I haven't had translated yet.
CN2, pins 1 and 2:
http://compirate.home.mindspring.com.../CN2_1and2.JPG

CN2, pins 3 and 4:
http://compirate.home.mindspring.com.../CN2_3and4.JPG


The Hopper motor connections are wide traces and run to the 12 pin heatsinked part ( Toshiba 923k TA8429H) Shaped like an upsidedown 'T', the connectors are opposed:

1\2/3\4/5\6/7\8/9\10/11\12

A transistor bank maybe?

Power plus (CN1,pin 1 and 2) connects to a capacitor (50v 330uf) then to pin 11 and 10 of the TA8429H. Power minus (CN1, pin 3 and 4) on pin 6. Motor minus - pin 8, motor plus - pin 4. The motor traces are connected to the chip on both sides of the board (via pass thru holes and traces on both sides).

There are 8 IC's plus the ROM. First number/letter is position on board (1-4 bottom to top, A-C left to right)

1A-92 CHL6K
HC273

1B-SAME

2B-915
245C (printed on board next to--1245CF)

3A-393
832

3C-94 A826K
HC14

4A-95D3F8K
HC138

4B- 91F
HD
6433296F
VO1
GLORY -000 (says CPU A)

4C-TD 924
62503FB

Let the electronics guru's take it from here. Let me know if there is anything else you need.

[logicprobe]

You do nice work, compirate!

Those letters in that 12 pin power IC did the trick to find a spec sheet:
http://www.marktechopto.com/pdfs/tos..._datasheet.pdf

It sure confirms what you've said about pin 4 and 8 of that device being connected to the motor. Nice job.

Page 3 of that spec sheet shows the output of that puppy is a pulse. Hmmm... maybe even without a stepper motor in the hopper, they "step" it along with that.

Some more food for thought, anyway.

In simple bypass terms, I guess it would be possible to disconnect CN1 and CN2 from that board (thereby removing power from it), jumper CN1 pin 4 to CN2 pin 6 (-power), and put a PBNO switch between CN1 pin 1 and CN2 pin 5 (+power). Hold the switch on for as long as you want tokens to spit out.

You could even use a keyswitch, I suppose... to make it look impressive that only a person with a key can get tokens out of it.

You sound like you're on the right track with your timer circuit, though.
Maybe use the output to drive a relay... and use the N.O. contacts in place of the PBNO above.

I do agree, in either case, that you'd want a fuse inline with that motor... just in case it binds up. Don't want to cook the power supply.
That driver chip (in the PDF) is rated 3A, but they do heat-sink it. They might be running it hard. 3A would seem like a good place to start with a fuse... maybe up to 5A?

As usual... all standard disclaimers apply. Always assume free advice is FOS.

Sure looks like you're on it though, compirate. Now it's just a matter of finding the time and kahunas to tinker with such an expensive toy.

Good luck in your project, and be sure to keep us informed!

[johntofva]

RKnarr01, is there a college or trade school close by. I have found in the past that these places are willing to help for a small fee. (And it give the students something to look at.)

[logicprobe]

Not a bad idea at all.
As a teacher in a place like that, I would tell you that you have to sign a wavier saying you realize students are working on the equipment... and won't hold the school or instructor responsible if something goes wrong. It rarely happens, but it DOES happen.

Also... even though labor isn't charged at places like that (at least not in public schools, by law)... it's always a nice gesture to drop off some doughnuts or pizza for the students (and instructor )

You may also need to supply your own parts.

[compirate]

I just had the time and a little know-how (and I like to take things apart) so I thought I'd figure it out. I was going to do the Pachislo hopper/counter/timer thing before these dispensers came along, might still try just for fun. Was going to build it into a cabinet and use it as a token counter/dispenser using 2 hoppers, both computer controlled. I have anold Datalux police computer w/10.4" touchscreen that would be perfect for this but no time right now. Lots of time on the road to plan and design though!

Unfortunatley I should be heading back out on the road soon. Have to pay for the $5,000 worth of front end work I had done to my truck. New king pins, spring hangers/shackles/bushings, a new aluminum wheel and a tire (750 for those two!) and a front alignment. You'd think they could make a truck that lasts longer than 1,125,000 miles!

I'm still going to try to figure out how to copy the bills. Might try to convert one when the other 2 show up (fingers crossed!). That key switch would be interesting. I'm sure they make momentary ones.

I put the dispenser back together (and no extra parts!) and it still works fine. I have bypassed the hopper empty signal so it runs even when empty. The hopper runs forward for several seconds and when the token sensor dosen't sense anything, it runs backward for a couple of seconds, then forward again.

Just read the pdf. I'm not that knowledgeable but that's exactly it. It's mostly greek to me but shouldn't a couple of well placed wires tapping off some power then connected to one of the pins make the hopper run? Personally though, the more you can stay away from sensitive electrical components the better. Simple-Power, relay, switch, motor. If the switch is single pole, double throw momentary with 2 relays, then you can reverse the motor in the event of a jam or tokens are not being dispensed properly.


Read pg 3. I thing the pulsing is it's effort to protect itself from overcurrent.

[compirate]

Just did a little searching and found this:

http://store.qkits.com/moreinfo.cfm/QK154

4 digit presettable down counter w/output. Has 2 output modes that could be useful for running the dispenser. Only thing is, when power is disconnected, unit has to be reprogramed. A couple of relays and a micro switch on the hopper for count and it should be able to be set for any number of tokens to 9999. A few other components and it should be able to use the onboard photo sensor (power for the LED and whatever components for the phototransistor)(no, I'm obviously not an electrical engineer!). Just ordered one of these, will let everyone know how well it turns out!

With shipping to Md-$22.27

[compirate]

The count sensor on this hopper is a proximity not optical sensor. The hopper is an Asahi Seiko SW-595 and the sensor is an Asahi Seiko CS-A8 w/4 wires - red, black, yellow, white. Just wrote an email to Asahi Seiko USA asking for specs, we'll see! All the prox. sensors I have found are 2 and 3 wire. Are other hoppers optical?

[drdread]

I roll my tokens. I was looking at a North American bill changer to dispense tokens and the NorthAmerican ones are just too huge. I could have an industrial ice maker in the same spot.

I am kind of shopping for one of the stainless steel casino change carts. I am sure with vegas going ticket in/out there has to be a number of these gathering dust.

If anyone is looking for a Vegas style change cart, go to this link and click on "Furniture". There are 12 casino change carts up for auction and most have a starting bid of $10.

http://www.auctionandappraise.com/auction6.htm