I'm hooked but need help again

[bobandyo]

After buying my first machine a few weeks ago and fixing that one (with your help) I went out and bought my second machine. I believe its an early modern Nishijin Trapeze. It seemed to be working fine at the pickup location and briefly after I got it home. Just after running out of balls (perhaps coincidently) at the front tray, the ball launcher stopped working. I'm hoping its something simple like a reset switch and not the motor. Here is a video, hopefully you can once again point me in the right direction.

thanks,

bob

[CarlW]

That is a Hanemono!

Very nice!

Your machine is a model C with the electronics overlaid. It is considered an "early" modern. Make sure the see saw is in the "up" position; unplug it; fill the top tray and try again. My experience is that it is normal to go into alarm mode if you run out of reward balls at any time and the see saw would need to be reset. Could not tell from your video if there are yellow paint dabs on the see saw. Sometimes the importer did paint the see saw reset and sometimes there is a string attached to the see saw reset.

If you send me a pm, I can forward you the importer's instructions for that model. I don't think the instructions I have are on the forum...

[bobandyo]

I do see some yellow dabs. I'm attaching 4 pictures of the back in the hopes you can direct me furthur. I believe the see saw you refer to is in the 2nd picture. Is that the white plastic piece near the top of the picture that has a downward pointing arrow near it? If so, that is where there is a wire hanging down which I thought was the reset mechanism. I'v etried to move it up (and down) turning the power on and off and am getting no good result. Do I send you a PM with my e-mail address?

[Steve Cebu]

Looks like you might have a ball jam just before the shooter mechanism. This means balls are not going to the shooter.
I've had this happen on an older modern.
Open up the front of the machine where you access the cell.
Then under that you should be able to open the tray below that. That feeds the shooter.
Check to see if there are balls jammed in there. If not try and make sure the balls are getting to the shooter.
There is a mechanism to prevent balls from going to the shooter when it's out of balls.
If that stuck you won't feed any balls.
In your video I didn't see any balls in the front tray. So make sure you have some in there at least 20-30
after you check for a jam.

[CarlW]

That is indeed the see saw in picture two and it is in the wrong position for normal play...

Steve is correct about the front trays. You can open the front bottom tray - just the same as your vintage Nishijin. Careful, it will tip over! ;-)

You can manually move the loader and see if a ball pops out. Even if no balls are loading you should still here a clunking noise and see the shooter moving if the handle is turned. Sometimes there is a metal ring that needs to be touchin your hand (grounded). I don't remember on the early moderns or not. Also, in one of your pictures is the adjustment knob for the shooter, my experience is there really is only two or three clicks where it works, not much of an adjustment.

I did email you the instructions I have for the early modern Nishijin and Sankyo machines.
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Also! On the back of the machine - bottom exit that dumps balls into the front bottom tray. I thought there was a micro switch that senses if the bottom tray is over full. That switch would disable the shooting handle. If you took another picture - I might be able to identify it. It would definitely have just two wires going to it (assuming it is there)

[bobandyo]

I disassembled/assessed and re-assembled the back of the ball launching mechanism a few times and although everything looks OK to my inexperienced eye I can't seem to get it to work. I am attaching two videos and a couple of photos in the hopes that someone can tell me what is wrong.


IMG_2177.jpgIMG_2179.jpg



PS I don't have a ball jam that I can see. I do not see a microswitch

Bob

[mxfaiman]

If you send me a pm, I can forward you the importer's instructions for that model. I don't think the instructions I have are on the forum...

You'd be very surprised where you can find them

Direct link: http://www.pachitalk.com/mxfaiman/Ni...o%20Manual.pdf

Thread link: Pachinko Manuals and Related Items

[Steve Cebu]

It looks like either you have a gear slipping or the motor is losing power. It could also be a tension adjustment.
My older modern has a dial with numbers for that but yours is actually slipping in there. You can see it's
juddering instead of making a hard pull and release.
Unfortunately I have no idea what could be wrong. You do have what looks like a dial adjustment.
That small black knob might adjust it, other than that I don't know.

[CarlW]

I think it is the piece / assembly you touch at 26 seconds into the top video. If you take that apart there is a metal part that may be rough and need to be smoothed out. That big gear is the adjustment. It should stay in one position and appears to me to be at the lowest setting of tension. The black knob on the pack should turn it. I really am going from memory and hope it is not a wild goose chase but I did have a machine with the exact same problem and was able to fix it. Also that piece assembly seemed to have a lot of wiggle in it when you touched it and I don't remember it being that way. Is it possible a mounting screw for that is loose?

[bobandyo]

I believe the problem is one of two things.- either 1. the assembly part at the 26 second mark as you indicated above or 2. the motor has diminished output.

1. I have taken the "26 second" assembly apart several times - everything looks clean (I will take a picture of its disassembled pieces a litlle later).
a) The central screw that holds that assembly together is a little loose. I thought that was how it was designed as there are two internal springs which if I tighten that screw fully would be totally compressed and the springs would really serve no purpose. i believe there needs to be a little give in the springs to allow you to make the adjustments with the gear alignments with the adjustment knobs (although i am not really sure of this). I have tried it fully tightened and with some give.

b) the two screws (@ 2:00 and 7:00) that holds the "26 second" assembly to the metal plate do not really screw into the plastic screw holes - they pop through it and help with the alignment but arent "fixed" to the plastic . Perhaps I will see if I can tighten that up. I assumed since both holes were similiar that that was how it was suppose to be, but perhaps that is allowing too much "give" allowing the gears to slip.

2. If I leave the "26 second" assembly out altogether (and reassemble everything else) then the plastic "comma" shaped piece (lower right on metal plate), driven by the motor, still results in a regular but weak hammer strike which looks good but is too weak to get the ball to the top of the machine. It needs the extra tensioning caused by the interaction of the gears. However, when i insert the "26 second" assembly, the "comma" shaped piece does not seem to be strong enough to go 360 degrees driving the hammer which leads me to conclude that the gear resistance tensioning is too great or the motor is not outputting enough power.
I will try to upload another video of this as the video above does not demonstrate this as the components are not all connected. I don't have a tester to see if the motor is really the problem and even if I determine that I do need to replace the motor - I am not sure what, where or if I can get a replacement part as the only notation on the motor is 50 Hertz. (electronics are not my strength).

thanks for looking and listening

[bobandyo]

Here are a couple of videos and some pictures. These demonstrate to me (and please tell me if you see it differently) that the motor is incapable of driving the comma shaped piece 360 degrees if the 26 second assembly moved the gear to the 5th tooth which is where I believe it would be at the minimum setting when I turn the front knob to its limit. At this point i'm baffled. I took apart the step down gear assembly (the part attached to the basic motor that reduces the rotational speed) motor and that looked OK (all the gears seem solid with all their teeth intact and well oiled). I can't open up the actual motor and wouldn't know what to look for in a transformer. The motor moves smoothly but I have no idea if it is rotating at the right speed or with the right torque.(any advice here would be good). At this point I think I'm just going to re-oil everything and try agian and wait for feedback.

[CarlW]

Here is a link to the spare handle I have, noticed the motor is missing on mine!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egBkYL-EZvs

[CarlW]

In your last pictures, the 4th and 5th parts from the left; my problem was that these parts were rough, especially the ring (yours looks good) and the ends (flat) of the spring. Can not tell about your spring but if it is really rough, I would try lightly sanding it down with 300 or so grit sand paper. I don't use oil for any parts but maybe lithium grease (not sure on nomenclature). If the comma shaped piece won't turn 360 degrees the motor is in there upside down. I could only get it to work in maybe three of the teeth positions. I don't remember which teeth it would be.
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And one last thing! Sorry for the scattered threads... from the back of the machine, turn your black knob (after it is put back together) all the way clock wise. Mine has ten "clicks" of adjustment total. It seems like yours is set at click five? Guessing you have tried this...

[candyflip]

Was this ever resolved OP?

[bobandyo]

Yes, see this : http://www.pachitalk.com/forums/pach...ent-motor.html