Power flash j box and wiring

[Dechonator]

Im an older mechanical pinhead trying to do some work on a friends Vintage Nishijin Power Flash. The previous wiring was/is a mess. The junction box was butchered. There was an older 24v chime transformer that was wired into the light circuit and tulip coil circuit (the 14v bulbs sure are bright!).

A few questions here; I have read in various threads that the coils are 24v. How has anyone confirmed this? I have disassembled every coil and have found no voltage spec or coil winding numbers.

I am not an electronics expert, so can anyone tell me what the function of the resistor circuit board is in the fuse/junction box? Currently, I have the game wired (through the circuit board), the output voltage at the plug socket to the coils measures only 8 volts. I know I measure 16v going into the board ( using the 16v side of the transformer). Can the circuit board be eliminated and wire the 24v side of the transformer directly to the coil circuit? What am I doing wrong here?

I could not find a suitable 10v/24v transformer so I am currently using a new Thomas and Betts 8/16/24v door chime transformer for testing (using the 16v side for tests to the coil circuit).

Is there any way to simplify this mess? The owner wants to hardwire the games, so batteries are not an option for the light circuit.

Any suggestions is graciously appreciated.

[wrkey]

I will look at my machine when I get home this evening. Since I've been working on a Pachislo in the same room as the PowerFlash I have my multimeter there so I can check the voltages. I don't recall seeing any 'circuit board' in my machine. I 'll also try to get some good photos of the wiring, on both the very back and middle section.

Take a look at my album as my PowerFlash may differ from the one you are working on.

Good luck!

[emmadog]

I just received a PowerFlash yesterday and there is no transformer. All the mechanics are in good working order after running a couple of hundred balls through it. I am basically trying to find out what type of transformer to use and how to properly hook it up as well as any other electrical related information. As far as I can tell, all the wiring is still intact minus whatever is transformer/power supply related. Not sure if those are the same thing as I am a newbie when it comes telectronics. BTW my powerflash has the little "Chinaman" looking center and not the "thunderbird" theme. Thanks for any info!!! -JC

[Dechonator]

WRKEY,

Thanks for the reply. I have attached pictures of the Jbox from two different Power Flash Machines I am working on. Both have the circuit boards as mentioned.

[emmadog]

Thanks for the information and I didn't mean to hijack this thread-but I'll definitely be able to use any info provided for Dechonator as well in my process of powering my PF up.

[Moparformances]

theres a question in modern talking about the same kinda information

so i copied my post from there

this is a transformer i bought from radio shack (over the counter instock)

im more of a vintage guy... but hears what i have put on 2 arepachi and a 3rd on my vintage model "b" with a solenoid.. should work fine for u as well... im sure some one will jump in hear if im wrong

this is what it says on the front

25.2 volt AC.2-amp

on the back the specs are

input 120vac, 60hz
output (load) 25.2vac c.t.@2a
output (no load) 27.7vac
current (load) 76ma max
current (no load) 140ma max

hope this helps

[sharmoni]

I bought my transformer here:
24VAC/36VAC Compact Power Transformer-The Electronic Goldmine

It's not quite what I was hoping for since it's a 24VAC/36VAC instead of a 24v and a 10v, but I just ignored the 36v wires and hooked up a 9v battery to power the lights. I was already buying a replacement solenoid from the online store and the transformer was only $3. You may need to buy a minimum to order from them, I can't remember, but they have lots of low-priced tools, and electrical parts.

Besides wiring in the solenoid I replaced, I didn't have to do anything to the wiring other than re-solder a few connections and replace the fuses.

I'll attach photos of my wiring in case that helps, but I'm pretty ignorant about electronics so I would recommend tracking down the other posts on the forum that have better info.

[GB_Jax]

I bought my transformer here:
24VAC/36VAC Compact Power Transformer-The Electronic Goldmine

It's not quite what I was hoping for since it's a 24VAC/36VAC instead of a 24v and a 10v, but I just ignored the 36v wires and hooked up a 9v battery to power the lights. I was already buying a replacement solenoid from the online store and the transformer was only $3. You may need to buy a minimum to order from them, I can't remember, but they have lots of low-priced tools, and electrical parts.

Besides wiring in the solenoid I replaced, I didn't have to do anything to the wiring other than re-solder a few connections and replace the fuses.

I'll attach photos of my wiring in case that helps, but I'm pretty ignorant about electronics so I would recommend tracking down the other posts on the forum that have better info.

Has this transformer been working well for you on the PF?

[steveflht]

hi
is there a positive and negative coming off of the transformer? I re soldered mine and it is not working

[Tink]

hi
is there a positive and negative coming off of the transformer? I re soldered mine and it is not working

If it's an ac transformer, no polarity. Post a few pics if you can. 2meg max size.

And welcome.

[sharmoni]

hi
is there a positive and negative coming off of the transformer? I re soldered mine and it is not working

I haven't looked at this in years, but here's a few photos showing the main wiring:
IMG_1267.jpgIMG_1266.jpgIMG_1265.jpg
The blue wires out of the transformer go to the electrical box at the top (via white wires) and the black wires connect to the plug wire. Hope that helps some.

[Moparformances]

hi
is there a positive and negative coming off of the transformer? I re soldered mine and it is not working

yes a few pics.. also does your transformer have enough volts and amps..

and of course

Welcome to Pachitalk

[pachiwall]

hi
is there a positive and negative coming off of the transformer? I re soldered mine and it is not working

Without pics...hard to tell you what to connect where.
"could you please tell me what transformer is needed for my 70's power flash machine the one i have says 120v on input side and 25.2 and 1.2amps on SEC side. i cannot find this one any where
please let me know what is comparable and where to buy it thank you" You also asked Pachislomarket.com what transformer to use and where to buy. Honestly, they may not know, as they probably only deal with modern machines. Kind of like me asking my local Dodge dealership a question about my 1985 Dodge Ram...they had no clue! If they couldn't plug a scan tool into it...they couldn't fix it!
OK...I've gotten way of subject! If you don't have the right transformer, I know that a Radio Shack #273-1512B works...however is a discontinued part. Searching the web, I found this: www.ebay.com/itm/Triad-14-VCT-2A-Transformer-115V-In-Chassis-Mount-7V-AC-2-Amp-Center-Tap-New/222430648458?epid=25008346425&hash=item33c9e6588a:g:0dUAAOSw uxFYvKf- On the output side, hook up both green wires to the brown or grey wires that look like a lampcord for the solenoids. Use the black (on the OUTPUT side) and either one of the green wires to the thumbscrews of the fusebox for lights.
If that don't make sense...start a new thread with pics. That way we can see what kind of troubles you have.

[Dechonator]

Sharmoni,

could you tell me what the voltage is at the socket to the coils? While power is applied, unplug the small black two prong plug on your junction/fuse panel. Insert the positive and negative lead of you voltmeter in the socket. Be sure the voltmeter is set to vac measurement.

Point of this exercise; to determine if the output voltage at the socket is indeed 24 volts. If you were to remove the two screws that hold that tiny circuit board in the Jbox, you will see there are 4 resistors attached to the board.

I am trying to determine how that circuit board is being used.

Many Gracious Thanks,

Dave


P.S.

Very helpful pictures!

[alstonj1]

those dont look like resistors to me they look like diodes and since theres 4 of them and 4 wires ( 2 in -2 out ) i'd be willing to bet its a full wave bridge rectifier .in short d.c. output .and judging from those selinoids that 2 amp door bell transformer probably will be straining with them.

[Dechonator]

Ya know, I suspected something was funky about dumping 24vac into a coil! My old pins do not have rectifiers that look like this. And,almost all the coils are dc.

What would you suspect the vdc output to be? How can I test he diode bundle to see if it is operating correctly? I would almost be certain there are many owners of this type of game out there, who have no idea that it is an ac to dc conversion. I would hate to hear anyone smoked all their coils or caused a fire...

[alstonj1]

check the input wires the output should be ac from the transformer(the white and black ) . the other two wires should be dc output to the machine (blue and red )at a few volts less but in d.c. .The wire colors are an educated guess.

[Dechonator]

I BOW IN YOUR PRESENCE JEFF

28.06 vac measured at transformer on 24 vdc secondary and measured 24.52 vdc at the output of the rectifier!

Now for the bigger question; since I could not find any coil winding information or marks on the coils , how can you safely assume what the current draw may be (amps or Ma?) How do you choose a correct size transformer for the load?

Dave

[alstonj1]

well ohms law dictates amps = voltage/ resistance measure the voltage at the coil probably 24 volt and then disconnect the coil and measure the resistance and apply the formula . but the amount is really not necessary. the machine is only going to draw what it can use and no more .In short a 4 or 5 amp 24 volt output transformer is more than enough for this type machine and will run cooler . if your current transformer is running hot while the machine is being operated then its being overloaded . .

[Dechonator]

Many, Many Gracious Thanks!

I will do some more tests tomorrow when my hangover wears off...