Panchinko & samurai-slot ebay

[RANMAN101]

Just to clear up the matter of whats legal in California: According to California law.....pachinko is illegal as well! I really think its sad that we cant legally own these in California, but my kids can kill hundreds of dollars at a Chuck E Cheese/ Dave and Busters/ or insert any other arcades name here_____________. Further more the schools can collect money from a state lotto, and schools and churches can have casino nights to raise funds. Did I mention that there seems to be a new Indian tribe every week here opening a casino! Yet I cant legally buy or play a pachinko or a pachislo for home entertainment. Not for gambling. I live in a weird place.

[janetcatherineb]

Well as my friend say's we live in Komie-Fornia.

~J~

[arbycoffee]

Yes the Left Coast, Stranger than words can say

[janetcatherineb]

Well don't even get me started on gun laws in ths state.

~J~

[ocpachinko]

Pachinkos are, and have always been, legal to own in California. The relevant law makes coin-operated devices that pay out in coins illegal. This has been held to apply to most pachislos because they can be readily converted to take coins instead of tokens. Pachislos with blocks in their token path that are converted to free play are sold by (among others)...Knott's Berry Farm! I think they know what's legal.

A 1972 law made (non-payout) pinball machines legal here, and our pinballs even offer replays! (Wooooo Hooooo!)

Since the seventies, Pachinkos have a long and continuous history of sale in California, since the pachinko ball is not a coin and is not understood to be a thing of value in the US. It's considered a toy, as it has never been used in gaming in CA but has often been used in the cool 70's-80's plastic toy pachinkos we keep admiring here! Obviously California allows ticket spitters; the tickets are certainly of more "value" than a pachinko ball is here.

As many of you know, slots older than 25 years that are manufactured in the US are legal here as well.

Sellers of Pachislos in CA have to have a permit and cannot allow local pickup. They can, of course, allow local pickup of pachinkos.

We are proud to be the former home of several of the largest retail pachinko stores in the 70's and early 80's; and pachinko still rules here! My addiction began with admiration at Gemco and Zodys (R.I.P.) in those old days, but has only been addressed in recent years.

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, though I play one on Pachitalk. I'll post the link to the law one day.

The dark side has no opposition here (and some say on several levels)...

[RANMAN101]

OC, I was just told info about Panchinkos from a lawyer. He was refering to Ca Penal code 330a. It just refers to any game using coins /tokens/ balls or anyother item that can be used in liu of money. I would post it, but cant figure out how. As you can tell.....I'm like a lot of people here.......I may not be completly legal in my state when it comes to my hobby/addiction that is pachislo. I was curious about one I saw in window at Knotts Berry Farm store. I didnt have a chance to look at. Question how do you make a pachislo coinless? Any one know?

[Tulsa]

I think you guys/gals should send AHHNOLD a "token" of your appreciation to his re-election campaign. I'm sure since they has so much "value" in California he won't have a problem paying for campaign commercials with it.

[imsimba]

To make a Pachislo medal/token/slug free. On the so called older easier to convert to coin ones, you remove the hopper and move the two wires from the coin sensor/reed switch and move them to the unused button/bet one or max bet button (your choice).

Ironicly the new ones are not "readily" convertable to coins and also are harder to convert to coinless because of this. They should be allowed for this reason alone but the world knows how our state capital works. Sometimes better than the residents until after the new law passes.

[janetcatherineb]

wow Everyone is getting all legal on me. CRAZY.. OKAY OKAY. well I have to say that I really don't know the LAWS of it all, but pachinko's were VERY popular when I was a kid, and those old plastic ones were sold at k-mart back in the day's. And the nickle and damn store on the corner use to have a pachinko in their front window. So Kinda odd do do all that if they were illigal..

Just my two cents.

~J~

[arbycoffee]

I be glade In iowa.

It's winter in Iowa
And the gentle breezes blow,
70 miles per hour at 52º below!
Oh, how I love Iowa
When the snow's up to your butt.
You take a breath of winter air
Your nose freezes shut.
Yes, the weather here is wonderful,
I guess I'll hang around.
I could never leave Iowa,
'Cause I'm frozen to the ground.

[azlew]

OC, I was just told info about Panchinkos from a lawyer. He was refering to Ca Penal code 330a. It just refers to any game using coins /tokens/ balls or anyother item that can be used in liu of money. I would post it, but cant figure out how. As you can tell.....I'm like a lot of people here.......I may not be completly legal in my state when it comes to my hobby/addiction that is pachislo. I was curious about one I saw in window at Knotts Berry Farm store. I didnt have a chance to look at. Question how do you make a pachislo coinless? Any one know?

Here ya go :

330a. Every person, who has in his possession or under his control,
either as owner, lessee, agent, employee, mortgagee, or otherwise,
or who permits to be placed, maintained or kept, in any room, space,
inclosure or building owned, leased or occupied by him, or under his
management or control, any slot or card machine, contrivance,
appliance or mechanical device, upon the result of action of which
money or other valuable thing is staked or hazarded, and which is
operated, or played, by placing or depositing therein any coins,
checks, slugs, balls, or other articles or device, or in any other
manner and by means whereof, or as a result of the operation of which
any merchandise, money, representative or articles of value, checks,
or tokens, redeemable in, or exchangeable for money or any other
thing of value, is won or lost, or taken from or obtained from such
machine, when the result of action or operation of such machine,
contrivance, appliance, or mechanical device is dependent upon hazard
or chance, and every person, who has in his possession or under his
control, either as owner, lessee, agent, employee, mortgagee, or
otherwise, or who permits to be placed, maintained or kept, in any
room, space, inclosure or building, owned, leased or occupied by him,
or under his management or control, any card dice, or any dice
having more than six faces or bases each, upon the result of action
of which any money or other valuable thing is staked or hazarded, or
as a result of the operation of which any merchandise, money,
representative or article of value, check or token, redeemable in or
exchangeable for money or any other thing of value, is won or lost or
taken, when the result of action or operation of such dice is
dependent upon hazard or chance, is guilty of a misdemeanor, and
shall be punishable by a fine not less than one hundred dollars
($100) nor more than one thousand dollars ($1,000), or by
imprisonment in the county jail not exceeding six months, or by both
such fine and imprisonment.

and

330b. (a) It is unlawful for any person to manufacture, repair,
own, store, possess, sell, rent, lease, let on shares, lend or give
away, transport, or expose for sale or lease, or to offer to repair,
sell, rent, lease, let on shares, lend or give away, or permit the
operation, placement, maintenance, or keeping of, in any place, room,
space, or building owned, leased, or occupied, managed, or
controlled by that person, any slot machine or device, as defined in
this section.
It is unlawful for any person to make or to permit the making of
an agreement with another person regarding any slot machine or
device, by which the user of the slot machine or device, as a result
of the element of hazard or chance or other unpredictable outcome,
may become entitled to receive money, credit, allowance, or other
thing of value or additional chance or right to use the slot machine
or device, or to receive any check, slug, token, or memorandum
entitling the holder to receive money, credit, allowance, or other
thing of value.
(b) The limitations of subdivision (a), insofar as they relate to
owning, storing, possessing, or transporting any slot machine or
device, do not apply to any slot machine or device located upon or
being transported by any vessel regularly operated and engaged in
interstate or foreign commerce, so long as the slot machine or device
is located in a locked compartment of the vessel, is not accessible
for use, and is not used or operated within the territorial
jurisdiction of this state.
(c) The limitations of subdivision (a) do not apply to a
manufacturer's business activities that are conducted in accordance
with the terms of a license issued by a tribal gaming agency pursuant
to the tribal-state gaming compacts entered into in accordance with
the Indian Gaming Regulatory Act (18 U.S.C. Sec. 1166 to 1168,
inclusive, and 25 U.S.C. Sec. 2701 et seq.).
(d) For purposes of this section, "slot machine or device" means a
machine, apparatus, or device that is adapted, or may readily be
converted, for use in a way that, as a result of the insertion of any
piece of money or coin or other object, or by any other means, the
machine or device is caused to operate or may be operated, and by
reason of any element of hazard or chance or of other outcome of
operation unpredictable by him or her, the user may receive or become
entitled to receive any piece of money, credit, allowance, or thing
of value, or additional chance or right to use the slot machine or
device, or any check, slug, token, or memorandum, whether of value or
otherwise, which may be exchanged for any money, credit, allowance,
or thing of value, or which may be given in trade, irrespective of
whether it may, apart from any element of hazard or chance or
unpredictable outcome of operation, also sell, deliver, or present
some merchandise, indication of weight, entertainment, or other thing
of value.
(e) Every person who violates this section is guilty of a
misdemeanor.
(f) Pinball and other amusement machines or devices, which are
predominantly games of skill, whether affording the opportunity of
additional chances or free plays or not, are not included within the
term slot machine or device, as defined in this sect

330.2. As used in Sections 330.1 to 330.5, inclusive, of this code
a "thing of value" is defined to be any money, coin, currency, check,
chip, allowance, token, credit, merchandise, property, or any
representative of value.

It goes on and on here :

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/di...&file=330-337z

Yep looks like Cal is SOL on Pachinkos also

[luckydog]

but, we don't exchange them for anything!!!!!

their only value would be the same as having a bucket of washers or bearings.

[Tulsa]

That's the ticket, punch a hole in the middle of your tokens. Surely then, the goose stepping California SS will no longer consider them a thing of value.

[arbycoffee]

No, not them, That's to easy.

My Mommie at the ***** house use to say "If you can't hold a real job son, become a politician".

That was because I was a Male and not one of the girls, they could make a honest living there.

[ocpachinko]

and by means whereof, or as a result of the operation of which
any merchandise, money, representative or articles of value, checks,
or tokens, redeemable in, or exchangeable for money or any other
thing of value, is won or lost, or taken from or obtained from such
machine, when the result of action or operation of such machine,
contrivance, appliance, or mechanical device is dependent upon hazard
or chance

and

Pinball and other amusement machines or devices, which are
predominantly games of skill, whether affording the opportunity of
additional chances or free plays or not, are not included within the
term slot machine or device

In a home, there's no exchange. And there's as much skill in a pachinko as in the redemption games at Chuck E's...just try to turn the knob all the way and win even a single ball (on most machines)--a ball that would only let you have "additional chances" if there is no redemption process.

And that's why pachinko has never been persecuted (uh, prosecuted) in California, to my knowledge.

Has anyone known anyone hassled for simple private ownership of even a pachislo in California? The only report here was for sale of a pachislo.

As to the coinless pachislo, they put a stopper in the coin slot and (I believe) give you an add credit button...but I'll look closer the next time I'm there.

[janetcatherineb]

Okay so I seriously want a Pachislo now.. I MUST find a way to have it legaly here in Komi-Fornia.

~J~
HELP ME!!!!

[azlew]

and by means whereof, or as a result of the operation of which
any merchandise, money, representative or articles of value, checks,
or tokens, redeemable in, or exchangeable for money or any other
thing of value, is won or lost, or taken from or obtained from such
machine, when the result of action or operation of such machine,
contrivance, appliance, or mechanical device is dependent upon hazard
or chance

and

Pinball and other amusement machines or devices, which are
predominantly games of skill, whether affording the opportunity of
additional chances or free plays or not, are not included within the
term slot machine or device

In a home, there's no exchange. And there's as much skill in a pachinko as in the redemption games at Chuck E's...just try to turn the knob all the way and win even a single ball (on most machines)--a ball that would only let you have "additional chances" if there is no redemption process.

And that's why pachinko has never been persecuted (uh, prosecuted) in California, to my knowledge.

Has anyone known anyone hassled for simple private ownership of even a pachislo in California? The only report here was for sale of a pachislo.

As to the coinless pachislo, they put a stopper in the coin slot and (I believe) give you an add credit button...but I'll look closer the next time I'm there.

You need to help them rewrite 330a and 330b!

Device and Slugs and Tokens are words that should be stricken from that. Plus the statement :

or tokens, redeemable in, or exchangeable for money or any other
thing of value, is won or lost, or taken from or obtained from such
machine,

especially the tokens part and the "or taken from or obtained from such machine" part.

It is a a** n 9 law that apparently has stopped people from being able to buy Pachislos and now it looks like Pachinkos can't be owned legally also.

BTW I thought we had a member here that is in trouble with this is in court right now or soon?

[janetcatherineb]

well I think Chuck E. Cheese should be in trouble too since you buy Tokens to play games that you win tickets from and you trade those tickets for valuble items, if you get enough tickets you can even get a game system. Isnt that a form of gambling according to the law? Maybe I miss read that, so correct me if I am wrong, but i think this is a very broad statement and it can even be interperted that claw machines are illegal also since you insert money and play a game in the hopes of getting an item of MORE value then that quarter or token you put in. Some machines even have plastic eggs with cash inside. And gumball machines have bonus insentives at malls, where you will get money in a plastic egg or a coupon for the mall. All gambling according to that law.

~J~

[RANMAN101]

Has anyone ever been prosecuted for home use of any of these machines in California?

You can purchase all of these in California if you know where to look. Check local dealers, some will say no others dont care.

[azlew]

Well all I know is that we have a few people here that certainly would be qualified to rewrite that a*s N 9 law. But until it is they can get you for just about anything there in that State. Take a look at 330b section D where they state that "or additional chance or right to use the slot machine or
device," maybe just maybe that means winning a free game is receiving something of value? Geezus this is one wacked out law

You all better move next door to Arizona

Has anyone ever been prosecuted for home use of any of these machines in California?

You can purchase all of these in California if you know where to look. Check local dealers, some will say no others dont care.

Ok isn't one of our members in court over this?

Well here ya go people in CAlifornia :

http://pachitalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18029

Read it and get out there and try to support him on this courtcase if it is still going.