Would you buy an 'enhanced' card reader connector dongle?

[compirate]

True, but I'll probably end up making it fit inside a regular D-25 cover. Firstly because I like the challenge and secondly because it will work out more expensive using a larger circuit board, a box rather than a D-25 cover and the additional cable needed. Also the surface mount components that have to be used to make it that small are actually cheaper than the regular large sized components.

I will also be making up a few short extension ribbon cables for people who have games in cabinets that are are a tight fit, and currently need to have a 'bare' dongle as there's not enough room for a cased one. For example on Cutie Honey the dongle sticks straight out the back, and would need two inches of clearance to the back of the case.



At the moment the plan is to have a completely independent self contained unit. There are two I/O pins available on the in-circuit-programming header (which is needed to put the control software inside the surface mounted microcontroller chip). The intention is to use one of these inputs for the external 'credit' switch, and the other for a jumper to select between normal and setup modes.

There's nothing to stop you connecting the credit switch input to a PC interface. But I'm not really the best person to do this as this would require software on the PC, and I'm no good at writing software for MS Windows systems (and don't even ask about Macs ).

If this would be a popular feature (and someone would be willing to help with the PC side) then I could look at adding some kind of PC connection, but at the moment I'm not sure what you'd want to use the PC for.

I can sure understand the challenge end of it!

I think the PC thing would be the ability to connect multiple units up and have the control software in the PC, possibly making the machine interface simpler. Kind of like a parlor computer, keeps track of all 'sales' from each machine, still dispenses from the buttons on the individual units.

[portercbl]

Daverob,
This is a great idea. It would for sure make playing Pachinko even more enjoyable! Then you would be able to have contests against one another with your machines!
I can't wait! Keep us posted with your project and put me down for a unit or two!
Jerry

[slothappy144]

I for sure hate having a button that is dead or I don't know what it does. The display being inactive is annoying as well. Just my insanity I know but as I said earlier it would make a great addition with a ball lift and battle counter. have credit add on most of my slots and I have used the credit dump feature of AutomATic to get tokens to play King Camel so I wpuold probably like the feature. Even though I like having Devospeeds cups handy with balls or tokens. Maybe I will just use the cups for drinking.

[fronzdan]

I can sure understand the challenge end of it!

I think the PC thing would be the ability to connect multiple units up and have the control software in the PC, possibly making the machine interface simpler. Kind of like a parlor computer, keeps track of all 'sales' from each machine, still dispenses from the buttons on the individual units.

The software is the easy part. What's trickier (being mainly a software guy) is how to interface the single PC to multiple Daverob dongles without spending too much additional money. Also, what micro do you plan on using D-Rob? If you go for something as powerful as an ARM, it has interfaces which might make some of this easier. You can get them relatively cheap from Philips...I think under $10. Then a PC could interface over rs-232, I2C bus or any custom protocol you come up with. Then you can feed back all the data as well as set credits and dispense balls from the PC.

As it stands though, the proposed dongle allows a single digital pulse from an outside source to control credits. For around $100 you can get a USB Digital I/O module for the PC. In that price range you get around 20-30 I/Os i.e. you could set the credits for 20-30 machines from a single PC. I may pick up a few of them and just do this...it would still be cool.

Basically you can go either one of two ways....make it mainly standalone, using existing controls/inputs as Daverob's will be. These will sell much more since he can keep the price down and it's pretty much a self-contained unit. Well done figuring this out!!

Or you can go all out, use a higher priced micro, spend a lot more development time and $$ so you can end up with something that's more programmable and controlled by a PC. Problem here is, from a marketing standpoint, not many people will buy it since it will be significantly more expensive. I was planning on doing something like this just for my own use with my slots, but never have found the time.

But I'm in for at least one!

[compirate]

The software is the easy part. What's trickier (being mainly a software guy) is how to interface the single PC to multiple Daverob dongles without spending too much additional money. Also, what micro do you plan on using D-Rob? If you go for something as powerful as an ARM, it has interfaces which might make some of this easier. You can get them relatively cheap from Philips...I think under $10. Then a PC could interface over rs-232, I2C bus or any custom protocol you come up with. Then you can feed back all the data as well as set credits and dispense balls from the PC.

As it stands though, the proposed dongle allows a single digital pulse from an outside source to control credits. For around $100 you can get a USB Digital I/O module for the PC. In that price range you get around 20-30 I/Os i.e. you could set the credits for 20-30 machines from a single PC. I may pick up a few of them and just do this...it would still be cool.

Basically you can go either one of two ways....make it mainly standalone, using existing controls/inputs as Daverob's will be. These will sell much more since he can keep the price down and it's pretty much a self-contained unit. Well done figuring this out!!

Or you can go all out, use a higher priced micro, spend a lot more development time and $$ so you can end up with something that's more programmable and controlled by a PC. Problem here is, from a marketing standpoint, not many people will buy it since it will be significantly more expensive. I was planning on doing something like this just for my own use with my slots, but never have found the time.

But I'm in for at least one!

Well, my ideas/plans are always more grandios than my income/ability!
But there is an ability to computer control the dongles with card reader input.

Insert card in card reader. Computer reads number on card (member number). Computer puts credits on machine based on credits in 'account'. Play away. When done, if any credits remain, press card return button. Credit counter reset to '0' and credits put back in 'account'. Move on to next machine.

[fronzdan]

So I assume all card readers tie back to a central computer? What is the interface?

How much do card readers cost anyway?

[compirate]

The parlor card readers are independant units. I think the only interface is for gathering sales/error information.
I was thinking about a 'home' system using readily available card readers. I picked up several of these before I bought the parlor units. Now if I can just counterfeit the cards I'm getting!

[daverob]

Also, what micro do you plan on using D-Rob?

At the moment the prototype is based on a PIC micro, as they're cheap and I've used them a few times before. The chip has a built in UART/I2C bus, but at this stage the I/O pins they need to use are already in use for the card reader interface. It might be possible to swap a few pins around to make them available, but it might involve losing software control over the 'Ball Loan Available' LED that's next to the credit display on the pachinko (I'm not certain that I'm going to make use of this LED as the card reader unit has no way of knowing if there are any balls available in the pachinko before it sends the command to start paying them out!)

If it's not too complicated to make the hardware changes to allow the I2C port to be used then I'll do it. I'm not promising that I'll be able to add the software side for the PC connection for the first run of units, but it will mean that if I decide to add the PC control at a later date, it should only need a quick software update for the microcontroller chip.

[drcrippen324]

im looking forward to this one

[compirate]

The only controls I can think of are:

1. Adding credits to the unit.
2. Reseting to '0'.
3. Relaying back to the pc how many credits are in the unit before reset (if possible).

[daverob]

So I assume all card readers tie back to a central computer? What is the interface?

How much do card readers cost anyway?

As far as I understand it, the genuine card readers operate as stand alone units (apart from the connections to the pachinko machines). The cards hold their credit value on a magnetic stripe which is read and written to by the card reader units.

I believe that the real units do require a connection to the parlour computer, and need to download audits to the computer every so often, or their audit memory will fill up and the unit will stop working. It might be possible to reset the audit memory with a special card, but I've seen no evidence that these special cards exist.

As far as cost, second hand units come up on Yahoo Japan every so often. Usually for around $40. But I haven't heard of anyone who's imported one having any luck in getting them to work (I assume that the parlour computer is needed for these units).

I got a quote from a Japanese dealer for a new card reader unit, which was over $2000, and uses the new cards which automatically expire after one month, even if you don't use them. The dealer also offered to supply me with a monthly shipment of cards for a 20% discount over face value.

There was also one recently sold on Yahoo Japan that had been modified to 'free play' (I assume that it was modified for demoing pachinkos at exhibitions etc). It sold for nearly $500, so it is not really an economic solution either.

[fronzdan]

Cool stuff!!

Just some food for thought...

One thing I've done on past projects is write a simple command parser for the serial port. Basically in your main event loop have the firmware queue up ascii characters that come over the wire. Every time it gets a CR/LF you pop off whatver you've accumulated so far and parse it for a command and args it might contain. That way you can come up with a complete command set that the PC application can use.

Arrghh...wish I had more time for this stuff...you're going to have a lot of fun with this no matter what you do.

[arbycoffee]

Thanks daverob for all your work for all of us here.

As to the pachitalk awards of the most valuable Member of 2007.
I put you in for the Award.
Pachitalk Treasure Chest

[arbycoffee]

Drinks anyone ?

[ocpachinko]

the most valuable Member of 2007

Seconded.

[daverob]

As to the pachitalk awards of the most valuable Member of 2007.

Thanks guys , but isn't it a bit early in the year for nominations.
Besides, I think you're selling yourself short there Arby, I'm sure that theres plenty of others round here who would join me in nominating you for an award .

[arbycoffee]

I can't be, I am on the committee to pick the winner. That is like Dick Clark picking himself as as miss america.

[drcrippen324]

intresting theory there Arby

[johntofva]

I can't be, I am on the committee to pick the winner. That is like Dick Clark picking himself as as miss America.

So.........You want to be Miss America? I thought it was lucky who wore dresses.

[Sid]

So.........You want to be Miss America? I thought it was lucky who wore dresses.

Too bad noone saved that picture