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Thread: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

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    Captain Weirdo Sid's Avatar
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    Default Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Please find below a recent discussion in the shoutbox regarding a home made ball lifter ( Bravo Birdbrain)

    it may be of great interest to some so have a look and please if you have any ideas or comments to add please do so.

    06-24-2006 10:46 AM MrGneiss bb are you really thinking of making a ball lift with a archimedes screw?

    06-24-2006 10:46 AM birdbrain now back to our regular programing: GACK!!

    06-24-2006 10:46 AM MrGneiss because I thought about doing that too.

    06-24-2006 10:46 AM Sid Your idea about the ball lifter sounds... very interesting..

    06-24-2006 10:47 AM Sid Screw YOU!!!!

    06-24-2006 10:47 AM birdbrain never seen a pachinko up close but do have some clear 1 1/2 tube and a 3 ft screw that fits inside

    06-24-2006 10:47 AM Sid sorry guys couldnt resist... please go on regarding the ball lifter..

    06-24-2006 10:48 AM birdbrain just a matter of building a tray that feeds the tube and cutting an outlet at the top that dumps into upper tray.

    06-24-2006 10:49 AM MrGneiss Really, stop being so childish.

    06-24-2006 10:49 AM MrGneiss It seem like it should work.

    06-24-2006 10:50 AM birdbrain as we said about 20 bucks for a 24vdc motor off an electric scooter(strong enough to push my 300Lbs along at 15 mph)

    06-24-2006 10:50 AM Sid thats definately an interesting concept and i am sure it would work.

    06-24-2006 10:50 AM Sid that would make for quick reloads..

    06-24-2006 10:50 AM birdbrain will put one together over the weekend and see how it works with marbles

    06-24-2006 10:51 AM] birdbrain: just a push button on frt or a float switch in the upper tray

    [06-24-2006 10:51 AM] MrGneiss: Like I said, i thought about trying the same thing, I just didn't have an idea where to get the screw.

    [06-24-2006 10:52 AM] Sid: ive been thinking about a hand cracnk system for a while but due to my Spiderman payou problems havent been able to get things going

    [06-24-2006 10:53 AM] Sid: hmm you could probably attach it to one of the attendant buttons on the front.

    [06-24-2006 10:53 AM] birdbrain: lot of shallow well drills have screw about 3 ft long on end.once they are worn driller toss them

    [06-24-2006 10:55 AM] MrGneiss: I know of some places downtown where I can get a screw for about $20...

    [06-24-2006 11:00 AM] birdbrain: how far up from lower tray to top of top tray?

    [06-24-2006 11:01 AM] Sid: approx 75 cm

    [06-24-2006 11:01 AM] MrGneiss: I shall go mesure...

    [06-24-2006 11:02 AM] MrGneiss: in inches...

    [06-24-2006 11:04 AM] MrGneiss: 29"

    [06-24-2006 11:04 AM] Sid: 75 / 2.54

    [06-24-2006 11:04 AM] Sid: 29"

    [06-24-2006 11:06 AM] MrGneiss: There is no lower try, so this is from the top
    of the bottom of the frame (?) to the top of the top hopper.

    [06-24-2006 11:06 AM] Sid: http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...aras/screw.jpg it have to be something like this..

    [06-24-2006 11:06 AM] MrGneiss: tray

    [06-24-2006 11:06 AM] birdbrain: ok so in actuality all you need is a wood auger like for drilling holes in 2x4s with an extention on it. the auger part only needs to force balls up tube a short way then as you feed more balls into tube they will rise out the top

    [06-24-2006 11:07 AM] Sid: thats why i said approximately as the bottom tray location can vary

    [06-24-2006 11:07 AM] Sid: now can the Screw be verticle or does it have to be at an angle..

    [06-24-2006 11:07 AM] birdbrain: if you put motor at bottm you would not nee extention!!

    [06-24-2006 11:08 AM] MrGneiss: I need to be exact, you know that.

    [06-24-2006 11:08 AM] birdbrain: strait up and down would be fine

    [06-24-2006 11:08 AM] Sid: thats my idea as you got all the electrical stuff there..

    [06-24-2006 11:09 AM] Sid: but ok so this thing works. and the screw is rotating some issues I see are

    [06-24-2006 11:09 AM] Sid: 1) feeding the balls into the screw

    [06-24-2006 11:09 AM] birdbrain: if you wanted it real fast just hook drill bit to your electric drill !!

    [06-24-2006 11:10 AM] Sid: 2) how to stop the balls from falling back down the screw if power is turned off or there are no more balls in bottom tray..

    [06-24-2006 11:10 AM] MrGneiss: I had one of those toy marble rollercoster things, and it used a vertical screw to get the balls back to the top.

    [06-24-2006 11:10 AM] Sid: hmmm.. this is certainly interesting stuff and i do think it is better suited for a thread..

    [06-24-2006 11:11 AM] birdbrain: 1) build lower tray with slopeing bottom

    [06-24-2006 11:11 AM] birdbrain: 2) screw would be at bottom pushing balls up

    [06-24-2006 11:12 AM] birdbrain: Gack!!

    [06-24-2006 11:12 AM] MrGneiss: I don't think thread would be strong enough, but someone should post this in the pachinko mod section!

    [06-24-2006 11:13 AM] Sid: http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...ras/screw2.jpg

    [06-24-2006 11:14 AM] Sid: ok so you would only need a few inches of screw attached to the motor and then the rest of the tube is screwless..

    [06-24-2006 11:14 AM] birdbrain: yes!! screw dosnt have to extend alll the way up though

    [06-24-2006 11:14 AM] MrGneiss: So are you thinking of the screw only at the bottom of the tube, or the whole way?

    [06-24-2006 11:15 AM] birdbrain: it wound just fill tube with balls and the would overflow into feed tray

    [06-24-2006 11:15 AM] MrGneiss: interesting!

    [06-24-2006 11:15 AM] birdbrain: no need for full length screw

    [06-24-2006 11:16 AM] birdbrain: let me screww around this weekend then will post sunday nite

    [06-24-2006 11:27 AM] birdbrain: all you need is short piece of pvc to cover screw and and start ball feed,the rest can be flexable tube easy to trywrap to things
    Last edited by Sid; 06-24-2006 at 04:54 AM.

    "I've stopped fighting my inner demons, we are on the same side now."

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    Crippenese spoken here. drcrippen324's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    was having this twisted discusion with BB last night the opnly thing i can see is the svrew would have to be plastic or somthing non abrasive ir it may scor or damage the balls wich would then transfer metal filings into the ball tracks and payout system
    My rice krispies told me to do it



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    Pachi Puro logicprobe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    That thought has crossed my mind too (short trip).
    Just didn't know where to get materials to try it out.
    Keep this going!!!
    logicprobe
    Retired - Living on a Wing and a prayer!

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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Quote Originally Posted by drcrippen324
    was having this twisted discusion with BB last night the opnly thing i can see is the svrew would have to be plastic or somthing non abrasive ir it may scor or damage the balls wich would then transfer metal filings into the ball tracks and payout system
    thinking about it more the abrasion on the balls would depend on a number of things mainly how they enter and exit the screw mechanism those are the 2 points i see causing the most difficulty to the ball. but i cant really see it being too much of an issue after all from what i understand the current ball lifters on the market work with a ball being fed into a tube by a gear of sorts, with the next ball pushing the previous one. still would have abrasion upon entering the gear and exiting. (the 2 main stress areas)

    My idea is that the screw speed would play very important part in keeping the abrasion to a minimum a slow constant spin feeding balls upwards may be less stressful to the balls. while a fast speedy spin may cause jaming and more stress upon entering the unit..thus. a constant low spin speed would be better.

    but this is all just theory at the moment.. hope to be able to build on Birdbrains plan and be able to offer something positive in parallel to his work..

    what ever the outcome this will be fun..


    "I've stopped fighting my inner demons, we are on the same side now."

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    Winnipeg Pachinko Correspondent dishpan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Have a look at the video and links in this thread. These inventive guys have had the same idea for a screw ball lifter (sounds like a cocktail waitress ), and made it work.

    http://www.pachitalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=julie
    If you haven't grown up by age 50 ... you don't have to!



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    Mr. Pachitalk arbycoffee's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    I got one yhat is around 25 years old by Daito.

    Attachment 2360

    Daito_2.jpg

    This uses a step to hold the ball and lift it up to the top. Like a water wheel.
    "This is My Personal Opinion and no others"

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    Crippenese spoken here. drcrippen324's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    ohhh i likes the look of that arby

    on the origonal idea iv been doing some investigation work on my Mrs favorit toy so i couldent dismantel it too far befor i risked death but the internal workings of a chocolate fountain look ideal as they are compleatly plastic also it has all the electrics needed ie transformer and speed regulator i may order one for £20 and so i can take it apart and try it if so we shold have all me need for £20 or whatever thay cost over there and just have to add a peaice of pipe to extend the lift high enough
    My rice krispies told me to do it



    please note pachitalk.com cannot be held responsible for any injuries or death that occur as a results of anything strange people like me suggest you do

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    Captain Weirdo Sid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Quote Originally Posted by arbycoffee
    I got one yhat is around 25 years old by Daito.

    Attachment 2360

    Daito_2.jpg

    This uses a step to hold the ball and lift it up to the top. Like a water wheel.
    been thinking of a water wheel type system too..

    but one plan at a time..

    "I've stopped fighting my inner demons, we are on the same side now."

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    Site Admin Tulsa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Yes, drench your little steel balls that like rust in water. Good choice!
    Meanwhile, somewhere in Oklahoma.

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    Captain Weirdo Sid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Hey... at 13 $ for a hundred balls i'll be mass producing them.... i;ll make a killing..


    oh and for the record there would not have been any water involved.. just borrow from the idea of the water wheel..

    "I've stopped fighting my inner demons, we are on the same side now."

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    Site Admin Tulsa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Quote Originally Posted by Sid
    Hey... at 13 $ for a hundred balls i'll be mass producing them.... i;ll make a killing..
    So will that make you a ball magnet?

    Meanwhile, somewhere in Oklahoma.

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    Captain Weirdo Sid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    I guess it would....


    "I've stopped fighting my inner demons, we are on the same side now."

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    Dr. Frankenpachi alstonj1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    heres a theory that should serve the purpose , try a screw twice the size of the tube (but the tube be only a little bit bigger than the ball) . mount the screw on the outside of the tube with a section of the tube cut out to expose half the screw into the tube . this would provide a wall on both sides of the ball should the screw stop plus provide a momentum to keep the ball moving when it runs out of balls at the base . if you make the screw 1/2 " larger than the entrance and exit heights it should stop any chafing of the screw on the ball .
    Last edited by alstonj1; 06-24-2006 at 08:55 PM.
    Jeff

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    Captain Weirdo Sid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Thanks for the input Jeff,
    any chance of a sketch so as we can have a better idea of what you mean...


    "I've stopped fighting my inner demons, we are on the same side now."

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    Eye Shooter websherpa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Wow, you guys are like mind readers. I just spent part of the week reading up on Archimedes Screws and Moving Ball structures, thinking there was an application there for moving balls for my new modern pachinkos. I was almost convinced I should take up welding and make up a little rollercoaster for my balls. In fact I have ordered a moving ball clock on a whim to add to the ambiance.

    I see where Jeff is going, but what I can't visualize yet is the cut-out that is required in half the pipe and how to cut it. If the cut were a straight horizontal, it would be a 1/2 radius of the pipe, right? And I am guessing the thing that would keep the balls in the pipe would be the shaft of the screw (or the cut out would have arms that go around part of the screws)?

    And archimedes screws rely on a slant of the tube, or would this work horizontally (that should have said vertically)? An overlarge screw drill, with a clean even dip in pasti-dip might take care of the problem of abrasion and provide some adhesion to carry the balls up more efficiently.

    In fact I had copied pictures of two ball lifters from a Moving Ball Sculpture artist as a sample, they both use pre-manufactured and commonly available wire springs that have been carefully elongated.

    In one example, you can see a motor mounted at the bottom and there is an interior tube that provides the tension (the spring rotates arounf the outside of the tube):



    In the second example, the spring rotates around two horizontal wires placed inside and at one side of the spring (similar to Jeff's idea, actually):


    The former idea seems simpler to engineer and manufacture. In both cases the motor could be mounted underneath (and poking through) a catch tray.

    I would totally respect anyone who could make one of these and get it working.


    That being said, I was also working on an idea involving a modification of the standard Pachinko cabinet.

    First off, most of the pachinko cabinets and designs I have seen have no shelf under the pachinko machine. All of the Pachinko Parlour pics I have seen do, and with good reason, this is where they put their pachinko trays to catch the overflow (released from the bottom tray), during a fever. In fact the pachinko machine is purposely sized for this I think.

    I realized this quite by accident when I set my new pachinkos on a workbench to test, clamped them down and they were back from the edge of the bench. I was winning a fever round and I said "hey! Now I get to use those pachinko trays I bought from VCG ages ago!" I put one underneath and not only does it conveniently catch the balls when I release them, but if the weight in the tray were to pull it down on the side over the edge, the tray fits so nicely in that space under the trays that it can't possibly tip forward and over! (I rechecked my pictures from Pachinko Parlours, and indeed they do have the shelf. Which is also convenient for drinks, etc.


    Back to the cabinet idea. What I was thinking was, a nice dovetailed drawer, possibly with a plexi or acrylic front, and definitely with a felt bottom and sides (cleans some of the balls and deadens the sounds.)

    In any case their would be two drawers, exactly the same, one at the bottom and one at the top of the machine. The bottoms of the drawers would be sloped slightly to the centre on four sides. Each sould have a sliding trap door at the bottom, low profile, that is spring loaded (to close), and longer than the hole is wide. Inside the drawer support at the top of the pachinko cabinet are arms (like a routed "U" shape) that fit around the hole. and attached to the bottom of the shelf support (which also has a hole in it at the top). With a little careful woodworking and some accounting for wood movement, when the drawer is pushed in at the top, the arms would push/slide the trap door backwards, revealing the hole and letting the balls load into the reward tray at the top.

    When the top drawer empties, and/or the bottom drawer fills, just pull the drawer out (which theoretically closes the trap door), and switch drawers.

    I want a half of all proceeds if anyone else copies or patents this idea for resale .
    Last edited by websherpa; 06-24-2006 at 11:28 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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    Captain Weirdo Sid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Very good Idea Wayne!!

    i think we are getting on the right track with all this....


    "I've stopped fighting my inner demons, we are on the same side now."

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    Captain Weirdo Sid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    Further Shoutbox brainstorming



    [06-24-2006 06:23 PM] drcrippen324: what did you think of my choclate fountain idea with the arc screw motor ect all in one easy box

    [06-24-2006 06:23 PM] drcrippen324: i compleated my DIY yesterday

    [06-24-2006 06:25 PM] Sid: I didnt get it..

    [06-24-2006 06:26 PM] Sid: what i mean is i couldnt picture what you ment by chocolate fountain..

    [06-24-2006 06:26 PM] Sid: if you got a pic handy maybe my thick head can understand..

    [06-24-2006 06:27 PM] dattia: I have a chocolate fountain....the motor is too darn loud. It needs volume controls for a more enjoyable dipping experience

    [06-24-2006 06:27 PM] dattia: Mine has a plastic auger to deliver the chocolate.

    [06-24-2006 06:28 PM] drcrippen324: thats the one i was thinking

    [06-24-2006 06:28 PM] drcrippen324: the auger is basicaly an arc screw

    [06-24-2006 06:28 PM] drcrippen324: hang on sid i get you a pic

    [06-24-2006 06:29 PM] Sid: i found one...

    [06-24-2006 06:29 PM] dattia: A kinder, gentler arc screw.....

    [06-24-2006 06:30 PM] Sid: well thats the whole idea behind the lifter.. the screw/auger

    [06-24-2006 06:31 PM] drcrippen324: it runs up the middle of the tears to the fountain that happen to unclip

    [06-24-2006 06:31 PM] drcrippen324: well they do now

    [06-24-2006 06:32 PM] drcrippen324: so if you unclip the tears and add a peace of pipe to the top hey presto a ball lifter

    [06-24-2006 06:32 PM] Sid: since i cant get a screw readily i am gonna try my hand at making my own.

    [06-24-2006 06:32 PM] drcrippen324: WOW id be inpressed

    [06-24-2006 06:33 PM] Sid: piece of dowel and a dremel ought to do it...

    [06-24-2006 06:34 PM] Sid: hang cranked for the moment and not attached to a pachi but its worth a try..

    [06-24-2006 06:37 PM] drcrippen324: so do you get my idea now

    [06-24-2006 06:39 PM] Sid: yeah i get your idea.....

    [06-24-2006 06:39 PM] drcrippen324: what do you think apart from commiting sacralidge and dismateling a chocolate fountain

    [06-24-2006 06:40 PM] luckydog: it sounds like a good idea, but would it lift the ball high enough

    [06-24-2006 06:41 PM] Sid: well since i have never seen a chocolate fountain in real life before i can not really offer a proper opinion.

    [06-24-2006 06:41 PM] Sid: but since this is pachitalk and opinions are like.. ahem....

    [06-24-2006 06:41 PM] luckydog: maybe taper to a small pcv above the screw

    [06-24-2006 06:41 PM] luckydog: less ball weight above the screw

    [06-24-2006 06:42 PM] drcrippen324: well i was thinking along the lines of if you extended the the tube the auger would cram balls into the tube till they overflowed in to the hopper at the top

    [06-24-2006 06:42 PM] Sid: if it works on the same basis as the screw i dont see how it wouldnt work.

    [06-24-2006 06:42 PM] drcrippen324: yeh an argur is an arc screw just less abrupt if you understand

    [06-24-2006 06:43 PM] luckydog: patent pending

    [06-24-2006 06:43 PM] drcrippen324: i know what you mean about less weaight above the screw

    [06-24-2006 06:43 PM] Sid: im sure the japanese have us beat on this idea...

    [06-24-2006 06:44 PM] drcrippen324: well there ball lifter is proven product

    [06-24-2006 06:45 PM] drcrippen324: and like a ball lifter just add a tredel switch to the on off and place it in the payout hopper

    [06-24-2006 06:46 PM] Sid: well thats the easy part...

    [06-24-2006 06:47 PM] Sid: the hard part is the finding an easy DIY way of making a liftre..

    [06-24-2006 06:47 PM] Sid: what we need is ideally a Macgyver style ball lifer

    [06-24-2006 06:47 PM] drcrippen324: hmmm dare i ask Macgyver ???

    [06-24-2006 06:48 PM] Sid: which translates into being able to be made with a swiss army knife a stick of gum and a toilet paper tube..

    [06-24-2006 06:48 PM] luckydog: mission Impossible style

    [06-24-2006 06:49 PM] Sid: in laymans terms.. something that can be made with readily available parts with minimal effort and above all cost..

    [06-24-2006 06:49 PM] drcrippen324: ahhh the same way the A-Team made a full battel tank from the remains of a toilet factory that they found in an old disused mine shaft

    [06-24-2006 06:49 PM] Sid: exactly. the idea has to be both practical/ easy to build and inexpensive.

    [06-24-2006 06:49 PM] luckydog: were's Mr T when you need him?????

    [06-24-2006 06:50 PM] drcrippen324: thats what made me look at the fountain £20 buys all you need bar pipe including the on off switch and power suplie

    [06-24-2006 06:50 PM] Sid: because if its gonna cost the same as a factory ball lifter... whats the point..

    [06-24-2006 06:50 PM] drcrippen324: factory ball lifter is minimum £220 shipped from Japan or US

    [06-24-2006 06:51 PM] drcrippen324: and then you need a 110v suplie

    [06-24-2006 06:51 PM] drcrippen324: hmmm me thinks a chocolate fountain is gonna get it in the near futcher

    [06-24-2006 06:51 PM] Sid: expense was a figure of speach...

    [06-24-2006 06:51 PM] Sid: bye bye chocolate fountain..

    [06-24-2006 06:53 PM] dattia: Make your own auger with polymer clay and bake it.

    [06-24-2006 06:55 PM] Sid: hey good idea dawn.. I got a chunk of cernit that i should do something with..

    [06-24-2006 06:57 PM] drcrippen324: hmm is that the same as fimo ?

    [06-24-2006 06:57 PM] Sid: i think so..
    [06-24-2006 06:58 PM] Sid: once it hardens its like porcelin..

    [06-24-2006 06:58 PM] drcrippen324: hey what do you mean bye bye choclate fountain it only took 2 atempts to get the pachinko case rite

    [06-24-2006 06:58 PM] drcrippen324: no once it hardens it is like plastic

    [06-24-2006 06:59 PM] drcrippen324: bounces instead of shatters

    [06-24-2006 06:59 PM] dattia: Yes, fimo. That way you can shape the threads as you need them to hold the spheres

    [06-24-2006 07:00 PM] Sid: well this suff cernit doesnt bounce.. it has a porcelin finish... you could say plasticky but its rather dens..

    [06-24-2006 07:00 PM] Sid: it be easier then carving..

    [06-24-2006 07:00 PM] Sid: make a small one for testing... and away we go..

    [06-24-2006 07:00 PM] drcrippen324: http://www.fimozone.com/

    [06-24-2006 07:00 PM] Sid: yeah you did.. sometimes dawn i worry about you

    [06-24-2006 07:01 PM] drcrippen324: fimo explained

    [06-24-2006 07:02 PM] drcrippen324: ok your non productive shout box day is getting better

    [06-24-2006 07:03 PM] drcrippen324: if you used a metal spindel for the screw you could bake th efimo on to it in the oven

    [06-24-2006 07:05 PM] dattia: I guess I'm being bad today...I'll have to go stand in the corner with Arby!!!

    [06-24-2006 07:05 PM] luckydog: http://cgi.ebay.com/Irwin-29-1-2-Lon...QQcmdZViewItem

    [06-24-2006 07:06 PM] Sid: i was looking at those today while out shopping and 30+ eur and i couldnt find one with the right track size so to speak...

    [06-24-2006 07:07 PM] dattia: If you used a metal spindle and baked the clay to it, you determine your own size and shape of the threads. Good!!!

    [06-24-2006 07:08 PM] Sid: exactly...

    [06-24-2006 07:09 PM] Sid: and its easier to bake the clay around a spindle.... hmmm and at 130 the clay needs to bake you could use wood too...

    [06-24-2006 07:10 PM] Sid: hmmmm lots of fun stuff to try out tomorrow..

    [06-24-2006 07:10 PM] dattia: I think you could even use a wooden dowel, the clay bakes at a low enough temp that the wood would not burn

    [06-24-2006 07:10 PM] dattia: great minds.....

    [06-24-2006 07:10 PM] Sid: my thought exactly..

    [06-24-2006 07:11 PM] Sid: the dowel would be easier to work with afterwards too..

    [06-24-2006 07:11 PM] drcrippen324: i look forward to your findings

    [06-24-2006 07:12 PM] drcrippen324: they may save a poor inocent choclate fountain yet

    [06-24-2006 07:13 PM] Sid: well it would be easier.... and cheaper then a chocolate fountain..

    [06-24-2006 07:13 PM] Sid: dowel is very cheap comes in various sizes, and you can get a good sized piece of polymer clay for a few bucks..

    [06-24-2006 07:14 PM] drcrippen324: yeh psycotic greek guy could have us building a ball lifter that just spews pachinko balls and knocks our teeth out or somthing

    [06-24-2006 07:14 PM] Sid: all you need now is a little bit of elbow grease a tube for the screw to rest in and a power mechanism..

    [06-24-2006 07:15 PM] Sid: nahhh.. im not to keen on chasing pachinko balls all over the place..

    [06-24-2006 07:15 PM] luckydog: how about reversing a vacumn cleaner

    [06-24-2006 07:16 PM] dattia: The fountain auger has a square end on it to insert into the turning mechanism. That could be done with the clay also.

    [06-24-2006 07:16 PM] drcrippen324: no they would rattel off the motor

    [06-24-2006 07:17 PM] drcrippen324: oh you mean for picking the balls up reverse th evacume

    [06-24-2006 07:17 PM] Sid: well a vacuum cleaner would have to be very strong and well the entire vac mechanism is quite bulky..

    [06-24-2006 07:18 PM] drcrippen324: or fashion the dowl with a dremel to make the square end

    [06-24-2006 07:19 PM] drcrippen324: hmmm lots of food for thought

    [06-24-2006 07:19 PM] Sid: well the dowel can be adjusted at anytime.. depending on what mechanism you put it on.

    [06-24-2006 07:20 PM] Sid: SOUVLA MOTOR....

    [06-24-2006 07:20 PM] Sid: damn... why didnt i think of this earlier...

    [06-24-2006 07:20 PM] drcrippen324: souvla ???

    [06-24-2006 07:20 PM] Sid: we got these little motors here in greece used for BBQ's you basically add them to a skewer and it rotates the skewer

    [06-24-2006 07:21 PM] Sid: they are battery operated but thats the least of our problems...

    [06-24-2006 07:21 PM] Sid: cheap motor with durability as they are built for many rotations...

    [06-24-2006 07:21 PM] dattia: Is that like Souvlaki?

    [06-24-2006 07:21 PM] Sid: souvla is the Greek word for Skewer..

    [06-24-2006 07:22 PM] Sid: no dawn not souvlaki,

    [06-24-2006 07:22 PM] Sid: souvlaki is made on bamboo sticks.

    [06-24-2006 07:22 PM] Sid: the Skewer motor is for small items.. like chicken etc..

    [06-24-2006 07:22 PM] Sid: i wonder if i could find a picture.

    [06-24-2006 07:23 PM] dattia: or....they sell rotisseries for BBQ grills here. already has a long square skewer...just needs threads added.

    [06-24-2006 07:24 PM] dattia: whole lamb


    [06-24-2006 07:24 PM] drcrippen324: ahh i see
    [06-24-2006 07:24 PM] Sid: well a lamb motor would be too big but it would work in a pinch...

    [06-24-2006 07:24 PM] drcrippen324: that would be more like a pig roast than a bbq wouldent it

    [06-24-2006 07:25 PM] Sid: http://mud.mm-a3.yimg.com/image/951792046

    [06-24-2006 07:25 PM] Sid: there we go..

    [06-24-2006 07:25 PM] luckydog: http://cgi.ebay.com/Geared-Motor-24-...QQcmdZViewItem

    [06-24-2006 07:25 PM] drcrippen324: that dose look interesting

    [06-24-2006 07:26 PM] drcrippen324: that looks good to LD

    [06-24-2006 07:27 PM] Sid: an these puppies are made for spinning for hours..

    [06-24-2006 07:27 PM] drcrippen324: so they be hard wareing

    [06-24-2006 07:28 PM] dattia: ...the gears are turning...... bad pun?

    [06-24-2006 07:28 PM] Sid: exactly...

    [06-24-2006 07:28 PM] luckydog: I used geared motor in the search

    [06-24-2006 07:29 PM] luckydog: that one is 24 volt too

    [06-24-2006 07:29 PM] Sid: yes it is...


    [06-24-2006 07:30 PM] Sid: hmmmmi got a mess of old printers at work... maybe i will tear them open to see if i can find any motors in them...

    [06-24-2006 07:30 PM] drcrippen324: just be care full to put greese proof paper down if you baking fimo darn stuff stics to the oven tray i got hammered by the Mrs last time i played with the stuff

    [06-24-2006 07:31 PM] dattia: a prototype is in the making............

    [06-24-2006 07:31 PM] Sid: i always do that...

    [06-24-2006 07:31 PM] drcrippen324: i hope so im intrested to see if the groupe brainstorming works

    [06-24-2006 07:32 PM] Sid: with the wax paper down you can just put the tray away without having to wash it again..

    [06-24-2006 07:32 PM] Sid: im sure it will...

    [06-24-2006 07:33 PM] Sid: now to post it in the thread...

    [06-24-2006 07:33 PM] drcrippen324: cool are you adding it to the origonal

    [06-24-2006 07:36 PM] dattia: I don't know anything about motors, but I am a craft QUEEN. I envision this on the side of the machine, the balls being pushed up through a clear tube. You know, it is ALL about appearance.

    [06-24-2006 07:37 PM] Sid: yes a clear tube would add a bit of pizzaz now wouldnt it..

    [06-24-2006 07:37 PM] drcrippen324: ahhh thats why i didnt notice it

    [06-24-2006 07:38 PM] Sid: if you wanted to get fancy you could have it outside a case.. sort of like a barber pole on the side...

    [06-24-2006 07:38 PM] Sid: I hope this works...

    [06-24-2006 07:38 PM] dattia: That is what I mean.

    [06-24-2006 07:38 PM] Sid: oh oh we're thinking alike again.. i hope you know a good therapist ..

    [06-24-2006 07:39 PM] dattia: The motor and intaked creatively obscured.

    [06-24-2006 07:39 PM] drcrippen324: now that i do like but it would have to have blue led's lighting it or even nen

    [06-24-2006 07:39 PM] drcrippen324: neon sorry

    [06-24-2006 07:39 PM] dattia: ...but of course...

    [06-24-2006 07:39 PM] Sid: yes intake and motor out of the way....

    [06-24-2006 07:40 PM] Sid: it would have to be visually pleasing too.

    [06-24-2006 07:40 PM] dattia: ...this could be really cool....and I don't even have a pachinko!!!

    [06-24-2006 07:40 PM] drcrippen324: BB and i had the same idea almost about a stand for pachinko or pachislo made of the tred plate steele

    [06-24-2006 07:40 PM] Sid: you never know when this knowledge may come in handy..

    [06-24-2006 07:42 PM] dattia: I want a Top Gun.....I prefer wood to metal.


    [06-24-2006 07:58 PM] alstonj1: hey doc i may have a solution to Sid and your problem with the ball lifter design .take a look at the thread and let me know what you think.

    [06-24-2006 07:58 PM] Sid: i think its best for all of us involved..

    [06-24-2006 07:59 PM] Sid: Thanks for that Jeff...

    [06-24-2006 07:59 PM] alstonj1: hi ya dawn

    [06-24-2006 07:59 PM] alstonj1: no prob sid glad to help

    [06-24-2006 07:59 PM] Sid: sounds good but having trouble visualizing it.. any chance of you posting a sketch?

    [06-24-2006 08:00 PM] dattia: I hear Gold Bond is good for that chafing issue.

    [06-24-2006 08:01 PM] dattia: I think it's time for me to leave Pachiland tonight.....

    [06-24-2006 08:01 PM] dattia: Hi Jeff.

    [06-24-2006 08:02 PM] alstonj1: just picture a tube be it up and down or at an angle now cut away half the tube and mount the screw twice the size of the tube so it is embeded half way through the tube and turn the crew so the balls go up

    [06-24-2006 08:03 PM] alstonj1: the walls of the tube provide the stop should the screw stop and also provide the momentum should the balls run out at the bottom .

    [06-24-2006 08:03 PM] Sid: ok i gotcha now...

    [06-24-2006 08:03 PM] alstonj1: should work

    [06-24-2006 08:04 PM] Sid: thats what we are counting on...

    [06-24-2006 08:04 PM] dattia: ...is that like the barber pole thing?

    [06-24-2006 08:05 PM] alstonj1: yep same principle
    [06-24-2006 08:05 PM] Sid: yes..... just a different way of powering the screw..

    [06-24-2006 08:08 PM] alstonj1: if you extend the screw beneath the opening and over the exit length it should stop any binding at those points

    [06-24-2006 08:09 PM] alstonj1: personally id mount the tube at an angle and the screw on the bottom side of the tube using it as the carriage to the top for the balls.

    [06-24-2006 08:10 PM] Sid: yeah we have come up with a couple new ideas just talking here in the shoutbox im going to go through the log again tomorrow and post them all.

    [06-24-2006 08:11 PM] Sid: angle could work nicely too..

    [06-24-2006 08:11 PM] alstonj1: but it could be done up and down as you wanted in this morning posts

    [06-24-2006 08:12 PM] Sid: we havent finalized anything yet... thats why we are posting the ideas...

    [06-24-2006 08:14 PM] Sid: since this place is full of people from all different walks of life etc.. ithey may get a click that someone else hasnt gotten.

    [06-24-2006 08:14 PM] alstonj1: cut a hole on the end of the catch pan and place a piece of cardboard as a ramp angling the balls to that feed hole and put the screw next to the hole and gravity should do the rest

    [06-24-2006 08:18 PM] drcrippen324: i like your theory i just read it geff

    [06-24-2006 08:19 PM] drcrippen324: it would look good with the tube mounted on the outside of a case so all you see is balls floating up the clear tube

    [06-24-2006 08:20 PM] alstonj1: that would work also easy to see if it should get jammed by a dust bunny .....

    [06-24-2006 08:20 PM] drcrippen324: ahhh good thinking

    [06-24-2006 08:21 PM] drcrippen324: i was just looking as a decrative point of view

    [06-24-2006 08:22 PM] alstonj1: if the tube were mounted with a hindg it could be opened from the outside and the balls should drop right out if it should jam

    [06-24-2006 08:23 PM] alstonj1: then closed and turned back on

    [06-24-2006 08:24 PM] drcrippen324: yeh im likeing this idea more and more where can i find a screw from as the closes i can get is a chocolate fountain auger

    [06-24-2006 08:25 PM] alstonj1: check a place like home depot they carry large auger bits but dont know how long they get

    [06-24-2006 08:28 PM] drcrippen324: hmmm could be worth a try

    [06-24-2006 08:29 PM] alstonj1: cut the tube to be a cover for the screw and it should work

    [06-24-2006 08:31 PM] alstonj1: problems making a bearing for the top and bottom

    [06-24-2006 08:32 PM] drcrippen324: no cause if i use a metal screw i can weld it to a scate bord bearing one end and a motor at the bottom

    [06-24-2006 08:32 PM] alstonj1: that will work

    [06-24-2006 08:33 PM] alstonj1: bearing should be about the right size

    [06-24-2006 08:33 PM] drcrippen324: id been thinking that way

    [06-24-2006 08:34 PM] drcrippen324: i gets alot of time to think while im at work depending what job i am doing

    [06-24-2006 08:34 PM] alstonj1: same here , well your pretty well on your way to having it done .

    [06-24-2006 08:35 PM] alstonj1: im the boss so i think as i please (one of the perks)

    [06-24-2006 08:35 PM] drcrippen324: yep i was thinking about the chocolate fountain after dismanteling the wifes and looking hence the bearing idea

    [06-24-2006 08:37 PM] drcrippen324: but the aruger in it isnt long enough in them thats when i started thinking about using the auger to force balls up a pipe with the auger feeding the balls from the bottom up

    [06-24-2006 08:37 PM] drcrippen324: then came th ehalf pipe idea from you

    [06-24-2006 08:38 PM] alstonj1: thats what i read this morning

    [06-24-2006 08:39 PM] alstonj1: you hadent solved the end of the ball problem and the walls to hold the balls on the way up

    [06-24-2006 08:39 PM] alstonj1: this does that

    [06-24-2006 08:40 PM] alstonj1: have fun with it , i dont even have a pachinko

    [06-24-2006 08:41 PM] alstonj1: but like mind f@#$ problems

    [06-24-2006 08:42 PM] alstonj1: they keep me busy

    [06-24-2006 08:42 PM] alstonj1: i get in to much trouble when im not busy with them

    [06-24-2006 08:46 PM] drcrippen324: i know what you mean

    [06-24-2006 08:46 PM] drcrippen324: i sware the Mrs finds me these sort of problems to stop me taking her choclate fountain apart ect
    Last edited by Sid; 06-25-2006 at 06:46 AM.

    "I've stopped fighting my inner demons, we are on the same side now."

  24. The following 2 users say "Thanks" to Sid


  25. #18
    Eye Shooter websherpa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    [06-24-2006 07:06 PM] Sid: i was looking at those today while out shopping and 30+ eur and i couldnt find one with the right track size so to speak...
    This morning I took 2 pachinko balls a number of common auger sizes (less than 1") and they have a combined width close to 1" (maybe a hair more). So a tube/pipe with 1" ID (possibly reamed out).

    The width of the channel in the screw isn't super critical, since gravity keeps the ball on the bottom of the channel, though with enough weight above, if the channel were too wide there would be friction as the balls bundled up.

    A smaller auger with enough power behind it should provide enough lift to push pachinkos into a much narrower channel that is one ball wide (thereby not wasting so many balls in a wider tube).

    Any metal on metal contact without grease is eventually going to wear away the chrome, a plastic finish or plastic auger would be best - I am going to look at those marbel maze thingys to see if there is acheap one there.

    A BBQ rotisserie motor would be ideal since it has a lot of torque power to lift the heavy balls.

    The other device I was looking at trying (if the channel is 11mm or larger) is a dosing pump. It basically has a cross in it that massages a tube (the tube could be removed), but I don't know if the motor would rotate fast enough to be practical. There are cheaper dosing pumps available for marine reef aquarium set-ups (another of my hobbies).
    Wayne ウェイン :rambo:
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    Sid

  27. #19
    Sphere Chucker fhagar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    I considered this before and thought the BBQ rotisserie might be a little slow. Think about a battery driven screw driver. Torque plus speed adjustment.
    Never met a Pachi I didn't like!

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    Sid

  29. #20
    Mr. Pachitalk arbycoffee's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ball Lifter - Archimedes Screw

    What kind of money you gentleman thinking of bringing this in on ?
    Will it lift about 40" and at what speed ? enought for more than two machines n?
    "This is My Personal Opinion and no others"

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