You Make The Call...

**bf_of_pf** · 02-20-2006, 03:55 PM

Remember when they used to run those NFL commercials that would show a particular play involving a penalty, then stop it right before the referee announced the penalty, saying: "YOU make the call"? Well, here are some unretouched photos of 3 out of 5 machines we received from Stealth Home Amusement after having won them on ebay. No machines were listed as "scratch & dent" models. One machine, however - the Aztec Legend with Gold Chrome - matched the description of a previous scratch & dent offering from Stealth - something I remembered because of one of the reasons given for it being a S&D - the fact that the plastic covering over the reels was missing. Not only was the one we received missing the reel cover, it also had cheap, tacky looking gold colored metallic tape running down the entire right side of the door, placed there in such as way as to "blend in", NOT as any sort of protective tape. When I asked Milt if he remembered having put an Aztec Legend in the S&D section, he said he did not remember.

Likewise, there was cheap, tacky looking silver metallic tape running down the side - and across the top - of the Savana Park machine. When I asked Milt why both machines had been shipped out with cheap tape covering the entire length of the sides of the front door, he said that sometimes the machines come in that way, and he doesn't remove the tape since he's pretty sure there are too many scratches underneath. He also said that Yamasas are notorious for putting metallic tape on their machines. (Note: None of the machines we got from him were Yamasas, and I've never found any cheap, tacky looking tape on any of our Yamasas.)

When it comes to the Tomcat, that's in a category all its own. There were at least three 9-12" gouges approximately 1.5mm wide carved into the top/center of the glass. These gouges could be seen from across the room. It is simply impossible not to have seen them. Period. Anyone working on that machine to get it ready or boxing it up had to have seen them. And after having spoken with Milt, I was informed that the gouges had in fact been seen by one of his workers, but the machine got shipped anyway. Make no mistake about it - this machine was a scratch & dent poster child if ever there were one.

And if it were only the matter of the Tomcat, that would be one thing. But when you factor in the other two machines - especially the Aztec Legend, which I remember being offered in his S&D section not all that long ago - the question that screams out is: "Is this seller dumping his S&D machines on ebay without any indication of such"?

Ultimately, the only one who really knows that for sure is Milt himself. However, just like in those commercials...take a good hard look at the photos of these machines, then you make the call.

NOTES: He did offer to take back the machines and refund the total cost, including shipping both ways. But that really doesn't begin to address this issue, as far as I'm concerned. Additionally, we reached an agreement as far as what to do, and he did follow through on what we had discussed. Finally, prior to this order, we had purchased 7 machines from Stealth, and did not experience anything like this. I would like to think that this is the exception, albeit a rather gross one; but by the same token, I feel it's important to post this so that other members can make as informed a choice as possible when it comes to any future purchases. Look at the photos...then you make the call.

http://img425.imageshack.us/img425/4...rrows016zt.jpg

http://img320.imageshack.us/img320/4...rrows028hk.jpg

http://img325.imageshack.us/img325/2...rrows047ch.jpg

(Note: The above photo doesn't even show the entire gouge. see photo below as well.)

http://img325.imageshack.us/img325/7...rows04b6fu.jpg

(NOTE: In the photo below, I pulled back the tape; it did not arrive that way. When it arrived, the tape was smooth, as if to simply "blend in". But I would neither own nor sell a machine with cheap, tacky tape running down the entire side of the door.)

http://img325.imageshack.us/img325/8...thsideview.jpg

http://img325.imageshack.us/img325/4...thwithgold.jpg

(NOTE: On the Savana Park below, I had already removed the cheap, tacky looking silver colored tape and thrown it away. I figured it had to be some kind of crazy mistake. Then I discovered the tape on the Aztec Legend, and retrieved the silver colored tape from the trash and photographed it on top of the SP.)

http://img434.imageshack.us/img434/5...takenoffsa.jpg

**Mike** · 02-20-2006, 04:35 PM

Please tell me you've posted pictures of the Tomcat before, coz I'm getting a strange deja vu thing going on.

**clau** · 02-20-2006, 04:44 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Please tell me you've posted pictures of the Tomcat before, coz I'm getting a strange deja vu thing going on.

I too have seen these very same scratches on the Tomcat posted on this forum before.

**Mike** · 02-20-2006, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by clau

I too have seen these very same scratches on the Tomcat posted on this forum before.

Cool, at the very least I'm not going mad on my own!

**bf_of_pf** · 02-20-2006, 06:21 PM

Some of those Tomcat photos had been posted before but the thread was removed. I reposted after having spoken with the vendor and having changed some of the content that resulted in it being removed originally.

**cwstnsko** · 02-20-2006, 06:52 PM

The tape on the sides of the machines is fairly common. I'm almost 100% sure that the tape was applied by at the manufacturer or in the parlor, I'm sure it wasn't applied by the vendor. I always assume that it was applied to repair a scratched case. I normally will not remove it for fear that it will be worse after removing it. If your experience is that the case underneath is pristine, I might try removing some to see. I'm not sure it's really fair to Stealth to post pictures of it partially peeled off. I'd need to see pictures of it before you messed with it to comment on whether it was reasonable.

It sounds to me like Stealth has offered to make good on the situation 100%, but you have chosen to reach a different agreement with him. Given that you've chosen this path, what is your intent in posting these pictures and airing out this issue in this manner? Are you looking for validation of your dissatisfaction in the condition of these machines? Are you intending to tarnish Stealth's reputation for good products and good customer service?

I think Stealth has publicly acknowledged that the scratched machine is something that his processes missed. It sounds like he has offered to replace the machine at no cost to you. The tape issue is a non-issue in my book, If they come from Japan that way, and the tape is not damaged in a manner that detracts from the machine's appearance, I don't see a need for the refurbisher to remove it from the machine.

Just my $.02 worth

**Tulsa** · 02-20-2006, 10:25 PM

NOTES: He did offer to take back the machines and refund the total cost, including shipping both ways.

You received a machine that was in rather poor condition. Welcome to the club, we all have. However you were lucky enough to receive yours from someone who was willing to make it all go away, pay you back all your monies and call it good.

So what is the gripe here? You received excellent customer service from a top notch vendor and had protection for your purchase just as promised in his ads? Yep, I'd gripe about that one.

If your intent in posting this is to hurt his business or reputation, I'm sure you're mistaken. If anything I would be more inclined to buy from this vendor, safe in the knowledge that if a problem does occur, I'm not "just stuck". You see, I've been "just stuck" before and that sucks, as opposed to this deal.

But that really doesn't begin to address this issue, as far as I'm concerned.

So receiving all your money back doesn't begin to address the issue? Huh? Are you expecting him to pay you for your trouble? You're after what, pain and suffering money?

This thread was deleted before I saw it, but I'm resurrecting it as I believe that everyone ought to see this nonsense. Everyone ought to see what these vendors have to deal with when an unreasonable buyer is buying their product.

Additionally, we reached an agreement as far as what to do, and he did follow through on what we had discussed.

You state you reached a mutual agreement but then you post this garbage, for what purpose? What good is reaching an agreement with you if this is the outcome? If all vendors were smart, they would cease selling you their product as the risk is greater than the reward.

This thread is now going to be locked but let it stand as a testament to all the selfish buyers out there that think the world owes them more than a fair deal.